GayPatriot

The Internet home for American gay conservatives.

Nature’s “9/11″ Has Struck New Orleans

by

It is becoming increasingly clear this morning that as the result of a breach of the 17th Street Canal levee, has in fact resulted in the beginning of catastrophic destruction of the city of New Orleans. This “after the storm” cruel twist is a blow to New Orleans residents who thought they may have escaped the pre-Katrina dire warnings.

The effect of the breach was instantly devastating to residents who had survived the fiercest of Katrina’s winds and storm surge intact, only to be taken by surprise by the sudden deluge. And it added a vast swath of central New Orleans to those already flooded in eastern New Orleans, the Lower 9th Ward and St. Bernard and Plaquemines parishes.

Beginning at midday, Lakeview residents watched in horror as the water began to rise, pushed through the levee breach by still-strong residual winds from Katrina. They struggled to elevate furniture and eventually found themselves forced to the refuge of second floors just when most in the neighborhood thought they had been spared.

“It would have been fine,” refugee Pat O.Brien said. “The eye passed over.” But his relief was short-lived. “It’s like what you see on TV and never thought would happen to us. We lost everything: cars, art, furniture, everything.”

New Orleans is one of my favorite cities. I am so sad about what is happening there today. One of my most memorable vacations (the 1988 Sugar Bowl) was in the Big Easy. And I have a special bond with Louisiana as I was born in Shreveport. My heart aches today.

I join with other GP readers who urge everyone to contribute to the charity of their choice that is involved with the disaster relief efforts along the Gulf Coast.

Katrina Aid Agencies listed here.

-Bruce (GayPatriot) – gaypatriot2004@aol.com

Comments

  4. But, on-topic, the U.N. has expressed an interest in helping out with the hurricane relief effort. They want to send down some preliminary “fact-finding” and “damage assessment” teams in a few weeks, but there’s currently a shortage of undamaged 5-star hotels in the NOLA area in which to put them up.

  5. As of this morning (Tuesday), several more levies have given-way and the fires are starting. Water’s rising in the French Quarter, and the only open roads are portions of the interstate that are elevated.

    This is far from over, it’s going to get a-lot worse and unlike Andrew were it was mostly wind-borne damage, In New Orleans there’s no access to the affected neighborhoods since the water’s not going to recede until they can pump the city out…and that could take a month or two.

  7. I’m sure somehow this is Bush’s fault.
    Comment by njz
    ===========
    nojiz (I’d like to buy two vowels, Pat)
    There is no way you could fault Bush for an unrepentant disaster of Biblical proportions.

  9. Chandler, you’re right…there is no way I could.
    Then again, I don’t hate him with every fiber of my being.
    Comment by njz
    ========================
    nojiz,
    I don’t hate him at all. I feel the same way towards a pitbull that has killed a child before it is put to sleep. It is ultimately sad and pitiful.
    Hate, never, pity, always. It is the good Christian thing to do.

  11. Actually I’m surprise Pat Robertson or Jerry Falwell hasn’t blamed the hurricane on the hedonism of the French Quarter yet (or the gays or the feminists – whichever demonized liberal group seems to fit).

  12. The Hurricane isn’t Bush’s fault. The fact that he spent today eating cake at a photo op is. The fact that the money earmarked for stregnthening NO levees was removed last year might be. Seriously guys, maybe you ought to recommend Bush actually do something. Today. Not a pathetic conference call tomorrow. Something today. The President of Venezuela seems to be paying more attention to this than The President of the USA.

  13. Yeah, and if Bush had dropped everything and gone to Louisiana, Tom would have accused him of showboating (like the left did when Bush went to Florida after Hurricane Ivan). No matter what Bush does, the left is going to bitch about it.

    The decent thing to do would be to just set politics aside and start putting things back together. I am capable of doing that. Any other takers?

  14. Is it going to be Bush and the Tsunami thing all over again, Tom?

    I wonder how much aid we will get from those noble nations in Europe and our neighbor to the north? Will they just watch stupidly like they did on 9/11?

    Too many happy years spent in NO. God I hate to see this. Louisiana went red in 2004 but NO is very deep blue. The Left will be torn in half over this event.

  15. No..Im concerned about the Democrats in New Orleans and the Republicans in Gulfport, MS. I think political activity (such as pitching Medicare “Reform”) on a day like this is obscene. No, I don’t think he should have gone to Gulfport to hand out bottled water. But going to California to engage in politics on a day like this? Playing a F****ing guitar and eating cake? Give me a break.

    And as far as thanking the troops, great. He’s been doing nothing but that for six months now. Ill thank the troops next week. Civilians (women and children) need him more NOW. ’nuff said.

  16. Look, my larger point is that if its appropriate for Bush to go out and play politics today, its perfectly appropriate for me to critisize him for going out and playing politics on a day like today. You know, he probably wont be pilloried for it. But he should have addressed the nation (even in a press conference) and stated that he was cancelling his political events to deal with the crisis.

  17. The decent thing to do would be to just set politics aside and start putting things back together. I am capable of doing that. Any other takers?
    Comment by V the K
    =====================
    VThek,
    I am quite tickled at how you throw down the gauntlet of neutrality.

  18. That is not a bad suggestion Tom. I can agree with that.

    Can you match V the K, Chandler? I saw you posting on a hateful thread on Kos when your comrades were gleefully musing about all those unemployed Republicans in S Dakota when you all thought the military base was going to be closed. I will say that you did not join in on that sentiment but you felt no need to chide anyone over it, either. I’m sure there are some depressing threads on Kos right now on this issue. Its not unwarranted to imagine what the Left will make of things.

  20. I will say that you did not join in on that sentiment but you felt no need to chide anyone over it, either.
    Comment by VinceTN
    ======================
    VinceTN
    (And congratulations on all the pardons handed out; I hope you didn’t need one?)
    And not to receive false adulation, I HAVE ridiculed the fair readers of the ArseGass Bleeter.

    Generally, for the poor people of Bottom Dakota, I have nothing but thank you, thank you, thank you! As a Nevadan working in Hollywood, I could not have been happier to see Thune unseat Daschle so my own Harry Reid could take his place. Face it, what kind of leaders come from Bottom Dakota? Now, Clark County, what other people call Las Vegas, has had the greatest economic boom of the twentieth century. It is the city of the future today. It deserves to have a greater voice in national politics and it does, all owing to B.D. XXOO

  23. I think the president did exactly the right thing today. He addressed thoudands of sailors and Marines, many combat veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan, who had long been waiting to see him here in San Diego. By all accounts he lifted their spirits, which is a big deal, especially in a military “town.”

    What good would it have done if he had traveled to Louisiana or Mississippi today? The situation is chaotic; his presence would have been a massive distraction from the terrible work that needs to be done; and he would have looked like a craven opportunist flying in to steal the spotlight.

    W was right to let the governors and senators and congressional representatives from Louisiana and Mississippi and Alabama represent their constituents, and not to get in the way.

    W returned to Washington today from the vacation that so many seemed to enjoy mocking (as if any president ever takes a real vacation) to focus on relief efforts. Of course he’ll visit the inflicted areas as soon as possible without getting in the way – but not before!

    I’ll also say that it breaks my heart to see New Orleans and the region devastated like this. A levee at Lake Ponchartrain is badly breached and the city is flooding terribly, right now.

  24. What Butch said. I would just add that no matter where he goes, the president is always in communication with his staff and with DHS, FEMA, and other federal agencies. And from what I could tell, those agenices seemed to be doing everything possible yesterday.

    I’m certainly not a big Bush supporter, but I know the difference between legitimate, justified criticism and gratuitous bashing.

  26. Well Chandler, coming from a state like TN that has the REAL Senate leader, I can tell you, it’s not all that.
    Comment by VinceTN
    =========================
    Vince,
    You are sooo right. He is much better a Senator than, say, a doctor. Has he recovered from embarrassing himself over the Schiavo debacle. I hope so. And I just LOVE it when Trent Lott goes on national TV, removes the bloody Frist dagger from his back and politely declines to support him in the future. It doesn’t get any better than that. But you have realized that I don’t have a REAL Senator. Thanks for the update.

  27. He is much better a Senator than, say, a doctor.

    Are you a patient of Dr. Frist, or do you know anyone who is? If not, why are you making snarky remarks about the man’s professional competence? He has a reputation as a brilliant surgeon.

  28. If the left is going to bitch no matter what Bush does, shouldn’t that mean he should at least do something rather than not do something and still get bitched at? I’d hate for him to interrupt his vacation, but please. Yeah they might bitch, but at least they’d have little reason to. When he does nothing, well that speaks volumes on it’s own. Who needs to bitch?

  30. He is much better a Senator than, say, a doctor.
    Are you a patient of Dr. Frist, or do you know anyone who is? If not, why are you making snarky remarks about the man’s professional competence? He has a reputation as a brilliant surgeon.
    Comment by Butch
    ================
    He made public pronouncements and gave a doctors public opinion regarding Schiavo. He has to be a brilliant surgeon to fix where he shot himself in the foot. He should go back to doctorin’.

  31. Sen. Frist shot himself in the foot exactly how when he gave an opinion about Terri Schiavo? Surely he’s entitled to his opinion like everyone else. To many people, the real debacle was that a helpless woman was allowed to die by being deprived of food and water by medical personnel. That’s hardly a cynical, unusual, or indefensible opinion, and it’s certainly nothing for a physician to be embarrassed about.

    You should get back to your screenwritin’ – and stop slandering capable people.

  33. Surely he’s entitled to his opinion like everyone else.
    You should get back to your screenwritin’ – and stop slandering capable people.
    Comment by Butch
    =============
    Butchie Baybee,
    He gave a medical opinion as a docyor after reviewing the videotapes of the poor woman. You were the one that said he was the great doctor, don’t go backpeddlin on yourself now by saying it was just an opinion. But your kind likes to have it both ways. :0

  34. Dr. Frist is a first-rate physician and he expressed his opinion. How are the two incompatible?

    I commend to your attention this passage from the Hippocratic Oath: “I will apply, for the benefit of the sick, all measures which are required, avoiding those twin traps of overtreatment and therapeutic nihilism.”

    Now, good people can debate whether Terri Schiavo was the recipient of “overtreatment” or the victim of “therapeutic nihilism.” I’ll leave that for another thread.

    In the meantime you can put a cork in the “Butchee Baybee” type of crap you post here. It’s not funny and it’s not clever. If you’re going to opine about serious matters like life and death, you can at least maintain the pretense of being serious.

  37. And to forestall future idiotic lines of argument, name something Bush could have done yesterday that would be impossible for him to do while in California that would have made a significant difference on the ground in the disaster area.

  38. In the meantime you can put a cork in the “Butchee Baybee” type of crap you post here. It’s not funny and it’s not clever. If you’re going to opine about serious matters like life and death, you can at least maintain the pretense of being serious.
    Comment by Butch
    ===================
    Butch,
    you ain’t.
    Give it up girlfriend.
    Because I find you HILARIOUS.
    Baybee:)

  40. Now we have Liberal Democrats saying the destruction is Gov Barbour’s fault, along with Bush of course, for his opposition to Kyoto or similar.

    We even have a German socialist official blaming America, and Bush of course, for his opposition to Kyoto as well.

    Excellent attacks on the Socialist whore by Americans posting on the Spiegel web site that includes a few Liberals (non-Sheehan variety, I’m sure).

    http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/0,1518,372434,00.html

  41. Since we have no other (more recent) thread to talk about the disaster in La-Ms-Ala, guess this is the best place to sample Patsie opinion on the disaster. Which begs the question: Bruce, why are you diddling with the Manhattan Borough President’s race, Simon & Garfunkel, and other such foolishness when we’re all thinking about and trying to make sense of what may turn out to be America’s greatest natural disaster?

    Like most of you, I’m very disturbed at the scenes of looting in New Orleans and my first impulse is to ask: why don’t they just shoot the looters? Then, I remember they’ve still got tens of thousands of humans (all ages, sizes [and Lord do they have size there in the Big Easy], and health conditions) stranded in homes, attics, on rooftops, at the Superdome, on the freeways. I’m seeing a woman sitting on the freeway with the corpse of her husband lying beside her (the good Guardsman passing by couldn’t help her — could only offer her the advice of “move farther away from the body”); another woman guiding the corpse of her husband through the waters of local streets; a man bereft talking to a reporter about his dead wife, man and reporter both crying (broke my f’ing heart).

    Digesting all this, I realize that looting’s the least of the worries facing a city that can’t even begin to count its dead; a city that may not even be habitable for months to come.

    Then, I turn the channel and find stories of gas hitting $6 in Atlanta and zooming up elsewhere. I’m thinking OK, they’re just ahead of the curve on pricing. Then, I realize that gas was very likely delivered to the local pumps at least a week or more ago. So, what’s happening there? It’s called gouging. All of which makes me wonder: what IS the difference between looters and gougers during an emergency? The only answer I can come up with is: the gougers make a lot more money.

    Cut to the scenes on the freeways in NO again. 90 degree heat (110 on the asphalt?), mothers with kids, old folks. All day long, no water, food, shelter or any idea of where they’re going to go or what’s happened to people they know/love. I’m thinking, “they’ve got CG rescue teams dodging electrical lines to pluck people from rooftops and, God, what valiant people who’ll — all day long — sail around, load a person up, and escort them (comforting them) to safety. Why not just land a few of those birds on the highway out there and distribute some water and food, take the weak out, for chrissakes, take the dead and their survivors out.”

    This is not making sense to me. Is it to you?

  42. I have never blogged before, and I am trying to help a few people in New Orkeans if I can. I have rooms in my home to stay for free. Please tell me where to send info to help people if they need a place to stay.

  43. I really hate to be pessimistic, but New Orleans as we’ve known it is probably gone. In that hot, humid climate most buildings will never be habitable again – if they can be recovered at all from the deluge. I’m afraid that once the levees were breached it was all over. It’s breaking my f’ing heart too, Reader.

  44. This is wonderful, what you’re doing on this site and our hearts and prayers are with all the victims and their families. It seems God destroyed more of the South, this time Mississippi and Louisiana, because of evangelical Christian groups that regularly demonstrate against LGBT events. The Lord has decided to strike back at those who preach hate in His name, and is continuing to strike horrific blows against the red States. Florida has suffered great weather tragedies since the Bush elections. With Katrina, He spared the gays in South Beach and Miami, and crushed into the redneck anti-gay states of Louisiana and Mississippi, where hate is promoted in His name in churches everywhere. This is a tragic and sad justice that is so painful. The city of New Orleans, was to host a gay festival this Labor Day. Instead, all the gays were spared by the Lord, spewing His wrath and destruction against the hate preaching fundamentalist red State Christians before the event was to take place. God acts in strange ways, and, it is very sad when the very people who should be preaching love in His name, are being punished for abusing religion. The deific intervention also was seen this summer, with tragic losses and death blows against the Boy Scouts of America, another homophobic group. It’s time for the South to come together in His Love and not anger the Lord with false teachings anymore.

  45. Like most of you, I’m very disturbed at the scenes of looting in New Orleans and my first impulse is to ask: why don’t they just shoot the looters?

    Actually, I agree. However, you and I both know that the ACLU would probably haul the shooters into court for denying the looters their civil right to steal.
    I saw the film of the man who lost his wife twice. I even saw that it made it on BBC.com. Tore at my heart too. I just pray to God that he finds her one way or another so that they can be reunited or he has something to bury and finds some form of closure. I don’t know if it will happen, but I wish for a follow up story so we know what happened, though I think I already know.

    As far as the rescuers and the dead? Let me try and address this from my experience in emergency response. This event is what we call a Mass Casualty Incident or MCI. In an MCI, the responders have to perform triage. This is a system where you classify your patients priority based on what’s wrong with them. The dead have the lowest priority. Those who are injured and can be saved have the highest priority. “Walking wounded” would be the folks who you see walking around. Those are low priority as well. Folks who are alive, but have fatal wounds are pretty low priority too. Your first priority is to the wounded whom you know you can save. Yeah it sucks, especially for those who have to make the decision, but that’s the best way to handle it as long as you don’t have a 1:1 ratio of rescuers to patients.
    Get rid of any notion you have that the responders don’t care. They do and this event will haunt some of them as much if not more than the people who need their help. Sure it may appear that the soldier didn’t care, but you don’t know what he was assigned to do. The responders have a duty to help whom they can and, for the moment, ignore the dead. It’s not an easy job and he probably had something more pressing to do. I’d bet a paycheck that he probably wanted to help that woman with her husband, but it wasn’t practical.
    As far as the “walking wounded” are concerned, if you’re rescuing others, the only thing that you can do is hope that they can take care of themselves or find somebody who can help them. I know it sounds shitty. In a perfect world, it is, but that’s the way it goes.

    I know you didn’t bring it up, but I would like to say that I’m sick of the libs bashing Bush for not running immediately to NO. We know that would have taken away resources, like police and EMS. We also know that the same libs would complain if he had gone there. So why is that an issue? We both know that the president is never truly on vacation and that he can still run the country from Crawford, Washington, Sarasota, Kennebunkport, Hope and all points in between. When you get down to it, what difference does it make where he is? Why do liberals have to politicize the disaster?

  46. I know you didn’t bring it up, but I would like to say that I’m sick of the libs bashing Bush for not running immediately to NO.

    Amen. I’m still waiting for someone to tell me what Bush could have done from Washington or New Orleans that he couldn’t do from California or Crawford that would have made a difference. I mean, an enitre deck of Air Force 1 is devoted to secure communications gear that puts Bush in instant contact with every federal agency. (Some people should turn off Queer Ass Folk and watch the frackin’ History Channel once in a while.) In any case, from what I saw on TV, it looked like the Coast Guard and the National Guard were doing everything they could, it looked like local officials were incompetent (the crooked Mayor of NO, the dingbat governor of Louisiana) and that’s not Bush’s fault, it looks like FEMA may have dropped the ball but again, that had nothing to do with where Bush was on Tuesday.

    Furthermore, even though Bush came back to Washington on Wednesday, Hillary, Harry Reid, and John Kerry are still on vacation. Man, they must really hate those hurricane victims (applying LLL reasoning).

  47. For those who might, somehow, misinterpret comment #41 above, I want to make sure you understand clearly the meaning of one particular statement already being misconstrued:

    1-“(the good Guardsman passing by couldn’t help her — could only offer her the advice of “move farther away from the body”)”.

    —Underscore “good”. Read rest of comment as a recognition of the helplessness of the situation. This was NOT a criticism of the responders, for chrissakes, OK?

    Otherwise, the description of triage above was good to read again. It is a hell of a situation to be in — for both the responders and the victims — and I feel deeply for both. The rot and stench already setting in in NO would be enough to overwhelm most of us, not even to speak of the visuals, the sounds, the pleas.

    As to the politics of this, I’m not playing that game today — though I can understand it if some want to jump right to that. But, today, I wish we’d just focus on what we are ALL doing TOGETHER in this; what we’re hearing or seeing that might offer some hope that this is not going to result in one of those 3rd World death tolls.

  49. Personally I don’t think Bush could have done anything on the ground. I was merely pointing out that saying he’s damned if he does and damned if he doesn’t isn’t really a valid argument to those who think he could do more. Because if you’re damned either way, shouldn’t you choose to do something rather than nothing anyway. I was merely commenting on the logic of the “damned if you do and don’t” rationale. I don’t know what Bush could have done, if anything. I do think the civil unrest down there is worse than you’re seeing on TV. My company has offices down there and we’ve heard some pretty horrific stories regarding the rescue efforts and the looting. I would normally say focus on rescuing people but it’s chaos down there. It’s all very sad.

  50. Because if you’re damned either way, shouldn’t you choose to do something rather than nothing anyway. I was merely commenting on the logic of the “damned if you do and don’t” rationale. I don’t know what Bush could have done, if anything.

    The problem is, Britton, whatever Bush does, the individuals in question will interpret as “nothing”.

  51. I’m with Reader: contact the Red Cross and follow their suggestions. Simple and focused. That should help minimize any of the “charity” opportunists. We can take up any issues with the Red Cross later on. Britton, I also think we should protect and shelter our animals.

  52. Well I’m willing to give the benefit of the doubt for so long…but when this is all said and done, I think there will be some more than appropriate questions raised on how quickly the federal government responded and how prepared they were for this. I am amazed that the national guard is not getting there more quickly, especially with people still in hospitals without electricity, food and water. It’s not like there has not been warning regarding New Orleans and the reality of what would happen should a strong hurricane hit the city. While it’s difficult to work when getting shot at, there should be a plan to get people evacuated from the hospitals. I also will be interested to see how much the federal government intends to pump back into rebuilding New Orleans. While I’m often called a “leftist” on this blog, I would question the logic of pouring billions into rebuilding a city that sits 10 feet below sea level and is nearly completely surrounded by water and in the path of hurricanes.

  53. Like these?

    Now that it’s 4 days after the disaster, Bush is only later today sending an aircraft carrier to the gulf. God knows how many days it will take to get there. Apparently he’s also sending hospital ships and other boats that won’t even leave for a few more days.

    Do you get it? They JUST decided to send these boats TODAY. Why didn’t they send them last week when we knew the storm was coming? Why didn’t we send them on Monday or Tuesday or Wednesday after we already knew New Orleans had been wiped off the map? (Answer: Because up until yesterday afternoon Bush was on vacation.) This was a storm we thought would be EVEN BIGGER and a storm that we thought would hit New Orleans even MORE head on, yet Bush only TODAY decided to send more boats and more troops?

    A few problems:

    — Sending ships to the Gulf last week would have put them squarely in the hurricane’s path. Normally ships try to AVOID hurricanes, namely because hundred-mph-plus winds and waves tend to have bad effects on them.

    — Ships are not equipped to leave at a moment’s notice. They require time, measured in days, to load, to provision, and to return their crews in order to be ready to set sail.

    — Ships have to be able to get close enough to New Orleans. In case anyone had forgotten, New Orleans is not on the Gulf; it is on the Mississippi River, which significantly limits the number and size of ships which can approach the city — not to mention the fact that the river channel would doubtless be choked with massive amounts of debris and silt in the first place.

    — Ships have to have harbor facilities in order to offload directly. Think a hundred-mph-plus hurricane is going to leave much of them?

    In short, there were a lot of good reasons to wait until the hurricane had passed before deploying. Had the levees held, New Orleans would be in uncomfortable shape, but it would have been far less dire.

    Of course, John Aravosis and his fellow liberals would have deployed ships immediately — only to watch what happens when a hurricane hits a task force including hospital ships and an aircraft carrier. Assuming any of them survived, they would have then tried to force them up a clogged river channel. Presuming they made it to New Orleans (never mind about how they would turn around and head back to open sea when they got there), they would then magically levitate supplies from ship to shore.

  54. No need to deploy immediately, but they should have left where they currently are headed for that area the day the hurricane hit the gulf, therefore they would have been behind the hurricane. In any case, the national guard troops that are being sent (since Louisiana and Alabama’s troops are serving in Iraq) from other states are on their way, but should have left two days ago. I’m sorry, I think there are a lot of criticisms that can be made in regards to how the federal government has and is continuing to handle this. But hey, it’s a disaster and it won’t ever be perfect. Had Congress approved the money to strengthen the levees back when they had the chance rather than sending that money to Iraq, New Orleans might not be in such dire shape. The money certainly would have gone far in repaying itself over with how much this disaster will cost the federal government.

  55. No need to deploy immediately, but they should have left where they currently are headed for that area the day the hurricane hit the gulf, therefore they would have been behind the hurricane.

    That would have required starting the provisioning and crew return process at least 24 – 48 hours in advance — probably more like 72 hours when you consider the necessities that would have to be aboard for what is a fairly-atypical mission.

    Katrina hit on Monday morning at five AM, so they would have had to start about 5 AM on Friday morning — at which point Katrina was barely past being a tropical storm hitting Florida.

    Are you planning to call out the fleet for everything hereafter?

    In any case, the national guard troops that are being sent (since Louisiana and Alabama’s troops are serving in Iraq) from other states are on their way, but should have left two days ago.

    Another example of liberal ignorance.

    The Superdome opened its doors at noon Sunday, and New Orleans’ most frail residents got priority. The stadium is by far the most solid of the Big Easy’s 10 refuges for the estimated 100,000 city residents who don’t have the means, or strength, to join a mandatory evacuation.

    Residents lined up for blocks, clutching meager belongings and crying children as National Guardsman searched them for guns, knives and drugs.

    As much as you’d like to tie things back to Iraq, Britton, there were plenty of Guardsmen in Louisiana.

    As for mobilizing, it takes several hours — closer to days — to mobilize the Guard; after all, it IS a civilian army. Again, just like with the ships, you are arguing that the Guard should have started mobilizing and heading to New Orleans when Katrina was barely a hurricane and before it was even clear that it was pointed in that direction. Even then, remember what happened last year with Hurricane Ivan?

    I’m sorry, I think there are a lot of criticisms that can be made in regards to how the federal government has and is continuing to handle this.

    Of course. They don’t have nearly enough psychics on the payroll so that they know to deploy ships and Guardsmen to the exact location it will hit with exactly what they’ll need when a killer hurricane is still a tropical depression. Brilliant.

    What’s the next thing on the liberal talking points list — claim that “Bush knew” the levees that supposedly would protect neighborhoods would fail?

  56. Bush absolutely knew because the EPA had been warning about the possibility of this catastrophe for years. Hence the SELA (Southeast Louisiana Flood Control Project) creation in 1995 after a major flooding. Over 10 years, $430 million was spent to shore up the levees but at least $250 million in projects remained. IN 2003, the flow of federal dollars to SELA dropped to nearly nothing. The US Army Corps of Engineers has been quoted several times with admitting the lack of funds was because of the focus on the war in Iraq and the tax cuts by the Bush Administration which trimmed the SELA funding.

    I have ZERO doubts the Bush Administration was aware of this scenario. And was certainly reminded of the potential devastation as the category five hurricane headed to New Orleans. I’ll be interested to see what was done over the two to three days prior to Katrina getting to New Orleans.

    As for your facts above, 6,000 national guardsmen from Louisiana are currently serving in Iraq. Just FYI. While there were of course some guardsmen there, 10,000 were not sent there until earlier today.

    FEMA has been another organization that has seen dramatic cutbacks and while even I will say that the federal government should not be the centerpiece of a relief effort such as this (state and local governments should be tasked with this), the fact remains it has been the centerpiece for oh, 200 years in situations like this. You can’t gut an organization like FEMA without making sure there is an alternative in place first or exactly what is happening now will happen.

  57. And if you compare proposed costs of this, the money that it would have cost to improve the levees would have been more than repaid if they had held up when this happened. Now we will spend even more than it would have cost to clean this up. Not of course counting the thousands that will likely die and the hundreds of thousands that are going to be homeless after this.

  58. It’s not the federal government’s response to this catatrophe that’s supect, it’s the non-response of officials in Louisiana and in New Orleans that has been sadly typical. Not proactive, just reactive.

    The city has a levee board that has known that NO’s levees need constant maintenance, and much of it has been deferred over the years. The mayor and governor didn’t make evacuation mandatory, didn’t provide transportation out of the city for poor people who needed it, and were horribly slow to enforce law and order. It’s not as if hurricanes are rare in Louisiana, and every single model showed that Katrina was headed straight for NO.

    Contrast Louisiana’s response with Florida’s last year, when three hurricanes hit in short order. Jeb Bush was way out in front, getting the word out about evacuation routes, making arrangements for emergency supplies, and otherwise preparing Floridians for the worst. Say what you will about Jeb Bush’s politics, he was a real leader when disaster struck.

    Contrast Louisiana’s response with Texas’s. Both states are hit regularly by hurricanes – in fact the worst natural disaster before now was the Galveston hurricane of 1900 (8000 dead and the entire city destroyed). Texas is sending, at state expense, a convoy to pick up the stranded people at the Superdome and house them in Houston’s Astrodome. (That’s a very risky move given the behavior of many of the Superdome’s residents lately. I hope they frisk everyone before putting them on busses.) Texas state parks have asked vacationers to leave to make room for refugees from Louisiana, and they’re charging them no daily fees. Louisiana is still charging people to find refuge in their own state parks! Whatever Texas’s problems (and I’m a native so I’m painfully aware of them), the state works.

    Louisiana has been highly dysfunctional for decades. I love Louisiana, but it’s the most corrupt state in America. Corruption kills people.

    For his part Bush declared an emergency for Mississippi and Louisiana on Saturday, two full days before the storm made landfall. I’d be very reluctant to blame Bush for any of this mess. As a city, New Orleans has persistently refused to prepare in a serious way for the inevitable “big one.”

    By the way, Britton, hurricanes have been known to reverse course. The US Navy’s primary mission must be military readiness, even when disaster strikes domestically. And more federal money would likely have meant more money in the pockets of Louisiana’s legions of crooked politicians, not stronger levees. Maintaining the levees was the clear responsibility of the New Orleans levee board, and Louisiana has always had substantial resources of its own to maintain them.

  59. From http://www.lonestartimes.com/:

    “People arriving at the makeshift village would be receiving a “comfort kit’’ that would include soap, toothbrush, a washcloth and other toiletries. And a meal would be served.

    The Astrodome’s new residents will be issued passes that will allow them to leave and return as they please, something that wasn’t permitted in New Orleans. Organizers also plan to find ways to help the refugees contact relatives.

    The Astrodome is prepared to accommodate refugees for a month and perhaps up to 90 days. Eckels said officials of the Federal Emergency Management Agency will try to move evacuees into temporary facilities closer to New Orleans in weeks, if not days. In many instances, the Dome will serve as a short-term shelter until more suitable quarters can be found, he said.

    The Red Cross will run the Dome shelter. Evacuees will shower in four locker rooms once used by pro athletes.

    They will dine from scores of buffet tables set up on one of the Dome’s concourses. Aramark, which holds the concession contract at Reliant Park, will prepare hot breakfasts, cold lunches and hot dinners at Reliant Stadium and Reliant Center, the convention hall, and transport them to the Dome.”

    Wow. Texas has really stepped up to help its neighbors.

  60. I wasn’t blaming Bush. I clearly and knowingly left his name out of most of my comments above other than to argue the point that he would not have known the potential risk to New Orleans in a hurricane of this size. IF he did not know, it’s because he chose not to know this or was not told by his trusted advisors.

    My only implication on Bush is the fact that his tax cuts and the war in Iraq obviously had a direct impact on the ability of the US Army Corps of Engineers to finish securing the levees. Granted, who’s to say they would have held anyway. Nature is to blame for this, not Bush. But I think this disaster could have been far less devastating. I agree the local government has a great deal of blame to take. However, that area of the country is one of the poorest and the federal government had in 1995 made securing the levees a priority (which became less of a priority in 2003). Why? Because having New Orleans above water is in everyone’s interest…your’s mine, everyone. Take a look at the gas prices and you’ll see part of the reason why. It’s a major port, center of commerce for this country. It was in everyone’s best interest to see that the city stay above water. And so to me the responsibility for seeing that happen does in fact rest with the federal government.

  61. Because having New Orleans above water is in everyone’s interest…your’s mine, everyone.

    If only New Orleans could ever be above water again! The city lies up to 8 feet below sea level, and the entire city lies below sea level.

    You’re absolutely right, Britton: New Orleans is a vital port. The harvest will be coming in soon in the Midwest. Now that the Port of New Orleans is out of commission, how will all that grain be transferred from river barges onto ocean-going cargo ships? And the damaged petroleum production and refining capacity boggles the mind.

    The funds that have been cut were intended to fund a study of securing the levees that would have started in 2008. The levees wouldn’t be raised at all, only strengthened. Yes, this was a federally funded study to be conducted by the Army Corps of Engineers. That said, the responsibility of maintaining the levees and pumps rests solely with the City of New Orleans. In my previous thread I misspoke; each levee has its own governing board, so there is a patchwork of jurisdictions, with all the political fiefdoms that that arrangement entails.

    I grew up on the Gulf Coast and in that damp climate I’m not sure how they’ll ever get all those houses dried out. I fear that large parts of the city will have to be razed and rebuilt. Today I saw some photographs taken from space, and it appears that the French Quarter is fairly dry, so some of the city may be salvageable.

  62. Why? Because having New Orleans above water is in everyone’s interest…your’s mine, everyone. Take a look at the gas prices and you’ll see part of the reason why. It’s a major port, center of commerce for this country. It was in everyone’s best interest to see that the city stay above water.

    Britton, you HAVE been to New Orleans, right? Tell me, how many oil tankers did you see parked there?

    I’ll give you a hint — New Orleans itself is a RIVER port, not a deepwater port. If there was anything to protect, it would have been the Port of Louisiana, Lake Charles, Baton Rouge, and the offshore oil tanker superport. New Orleans flooding has nothing to do with the price of gasoline and everything to do with the damage to the ports.

    Meanwhile, how exactly were you going to keep a city that is mostly below sea level and shaped like a shallow bowl from being flooded by a storm dumping fifteen inches of rain, Britton? These levees must be better than we thought if they keep out rainwater — and it doesn’t take a genius to tell that a storm capable of dumping fifteen inches of rain has a good chance of being able to disable electric pumps.

    Oh, and about those pumps…..do you know that, without them running, major sections of New Orleans would be flooded even WITHOUT rain because the city is below the water level?

  63. The “Bush Cut the Budget for the Levees” is a canard on many levels. For one thing, even if the COE had gotten its full budget request, the levees wouldn’t have been shored up until 2008. Second, they would only would have been brought up to withstand a Cat 3. Third, we know if Congress had appropriated the money, Bush would have signed the bill. We’ve all bashed Bush all over the map for spending like a crackwhore with a stolen credit card. So, the LA congressional delegation should be taking a hit, not Bush. And, finally, the place where the levee broke wasn’t even where the Army wanted to do their work, which makes the whole argument irrelevant.

  64. People.. We need to HELP, some how. People in those states, are dying every day. Im in Orlando FL, and trying to get some sort of fund raiser started. My friends and I want to try to get all and any gay clubs or orginazation, that will help, to help. I may be reached at JaydenORL@aim.com. Please hit me up, if you have any idea(s). They need help TODAY, not tommorrow. Every minute counts. Our government may think, they are moving fast enough, but I don’t think they are. This needs to be put into the hands of the U.S Citizens.

  65. We can do this, if we all put our ideas into one bucket. Money is nice, but other ways is great too. Take 10 min’s of your life and see what you can do. It’s funny, how when other countries are in need of help, we are there QUICK. But when our own country is in serious need, that’s not so.

    JaydenORL@aim.com

  66. Hello all
    Yes I was in the french Quarter of New Orleans. I just got out on Friday night
    we had to hot wire a Friends truck sifen gas and run like hell .We had fire extinguishers and mace at the back of the truck cuz people were trying to high Jack our truck so they could get out.I cannot tell you with words the hell the city was like , on Thursday we were on the street talking to a Friend and just shooting the bull about where we were all from and stuff , i opened his beer for him and after a while we all separated our separate ways, that night after watching a guy with a hatchet break in to my neighbors House and a 2 hour full auto gun fight a block away , then the refinery blew up lighting the sky and shaking the house I finally went to sleep for a second when i awoke we went over to my Friends and found that in the night he was so dehydrated that he died in the night we had to push his body into the street, the cops came up and were poking him with a stick and saying ” Lets just drop him of in someone Else’s precinct ” .
    Just to give you a idea that’s just one instance of the stuff that happened . as of Friday when we left there was NO help, fema, red cross, water, gas, food, electricity, and not even a cop with a bull horn letting us know what was going on or being done, we even had the cops put M-60’s to our head cuz we aperently whent down the wrong street.
    When major negen said on Sunday ” LEAVE THE CITY ” it was only after he closed the bus station and the airport leaving us no way out, then after the storm the cops ( who were the ones opening up the stores to lute and were in those stores taking stuff too ) they siphoned all the gas right out of all the cars so if we did have a car to leave we were still screwed!
    I don’t know how this will effect us as a country but i was there and they Fucked every one in the city more than the storm its self !
    well that all said I’m OK and out I’m in Baton Rough for now trying to figure out were to go and what to do. all will work out I’m sure . If you know of a yacht job or a restaurant that needs a chef let me know
    take care all and don’t let these bastard government forget what they’ve done and all the people, Friends, family, brothers, sisters, mothers and Fathers that died because of there inability to act at all !!

    Darin
    Yachtprofood@yahoo.com