Comments on: Episcopalian follies

By: Roberto

Roberto — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 18:33:22 +0000

Fapo, Epicopalians are . . . politically clueless. They have been this way for a very long time. How long is a very long time? Ten years? Twenty years? Politically clueless? Maybe it aint what it used to be but the denomination has contributed more presidents than any other; ten to be exact, from George Washington, James Madison, James Monroe, Wm. Henry Harrison, John Tyler, Zachary Taylor, Franklin Pierce, Chestar A. Arthur, FDR, and Gerald Ford.

By: rightwingprof

rightwingprof — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 17:38:42 +0000

“Episcopalians are universally boring and politically clueless. They have been this way for a very long time.”

Since Henry VIII. From the beginning, Anglicanism has had to reconcile a broad spectrum of worshippers, so there were high church, broad church, and low church parishes, etc. It’s just that the conflict has shifted from Anglo-Catholic v. roundheads to orthodox Christianity v. feel-good, leftist, group therapy sessionism.

By: Peter Hughes

Peter Hughes — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 15:45:39 +0000

#21 – Is that the same as a dyslexic agnostic? You know, the one that doesn’t believe in Dog?

Regards,
Peter H.

By: ThatGayConservative

ThatGayConservative — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 04:41:22 +0000

“Well, I’ve always said, There’s nothing an agnostic can’t do if he really doesn’t know whether he believes in anything
or not.” -Graham Chapman

By: John

John — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 04:39:44 +0000

Many disaffected Episcopalians/Anglicans are swimming the Tiber as well, which is why we now have Anglican Use parishes. Personally I think there should be an Anglican Rite, but I do not work in the Vatican and make such decisions.

By: ShermanStreet

ShermanStreet — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 04:12:59 +0000

Had she been a Muslim first living in a muslim country and then converted to Christianity, a fatwa (an ok to assassinate) would have issued for her.

Here in the western world, she just gets commented on in blogs then we move on.

By: Roberto

Roberto — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 03:46:39 +0000

Peter, you´re right about disaffected Catholics becoming Orthodox so too, many Episcopalians. In fact, several branches or national orthodox churches created a western rite Orthodoxy. Litugically they use the tridentine rite (pre’Vatican 2) mass. As for ECUSA, I think the new Prayer Book sucks, except for the catechism. If I were a primate I would have kept the 1928 Prayer Book, remove the communion service , and wrap the book around the Anglican Missal or the American Missal, if the Cowley Fathers would´ve printed a peoples edition (which they never did) to accompany the the altar edition. The mass in the C of R (Church of Rome) is not much better than ECUSA. The tridentine rite,
which preceeded Vatican 2, is the same whether you attended mass in Naples, Italy, Paris, France or Keokuk, Iowa. The only variations permitted were those rites peculiar to monastic orders. For the good old days when Anglican and Roman nuns looked like nuns and not airline cabin attendants, or froppy homemakers, with only a tiny crucifix, a doily on the head, and maybe a cincture, as do the Franciscans, to identify them. If the faith, once delivered to the saints, is to survive it may very well be in the Orthodox Church and those Episcopal Chuches that reject the liberalism that has pervaded the denomination, e.g. St. Clement´s in Philadelphia, St. Anthony of Padua, Hackensack, NJ. the diocese of Dallas. St. Mary of the Angels, Hollywood to name a few.

By: HardHobbit

HardHobbit — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 03:27:13 +0000

“It wasn’t about intellect.”

Hence, religion.

By: Kurt

Kurt — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 01:22:33 +0000

oops… wrong word choice… i wrote “denominations” when i meant to write episcopal churches in my community. i was thinking of writing about the fact that most of the mainline protestant denominations are overwhelmingly left-leaning these days, but i didn’t want to start down that path…

By: Kurt

Kurt — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 01:20:00 +0000

I used to attend services at Episcopal churches, but when I moved to my current city almost four years ago, I found all of the denominations in the western city where I live were much too left-wing for my taste. As a gay male, I’m not what anyone would consider a cultural conservative, but it was the kneejerk anti-war sentiment that irked me. Saying you want to work for peace is one thing, but it doesn’t mean one needs to surrender to death or dhimmitude. But apparently, as the genius profiled in this article clearly demonstrates, many Episcopal priests these days clearly believe otherwise.

By: John

John — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 22:55:55 +0000

Crow: For the Christian-Muslim it would be turn the cheek of the infidel before lopping off their heads. See how simple that is?

By: Crow

Crow — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 20:57:21 +0000

1) Turn the other cheek
or
2) Chop the infidel’s head off

By: just me

just me — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 19:56:38 +0000

I get a little uncomfortable, when pastors and bishops and various other church leaders support or advocate other pastors or positions that are directly contradictory to some of the most basic Christian tenets and doctrines.

I think there are definitely some gray areas when it comes to theology and doctrine, but believing in Jesus as savior and Islam are about as contradictory as you can get, and to be one, means abandoning the main tenets of the other.

By: Peter Hughes

Peter Hughes — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 19:00:00 +0000

#9 – Thanks but no thanks. I’d rather go to a church that encourages worship and thoughts of everlasting life, rather than indoctrination and political posturing.

I’ve been to Greek Orthodox services in Houston, Dallas, NYC, Athens, Toronto and Montreal. In NONE of them were there any sermons or homilies given that would be construed as political.

Also, after Vatican II, we got a lot of disaffected Catholics who despised the democratization of the Catholic Church. Just FYI.

Regards,
Peter H.

By: Synova

Synova — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 17:46:34 +0000

#8 Yes.

I’m not surprised by the “I’m a Christian and a Muslem” thing since I’ve come across at least one person who claimed to be a Christian and a witch. “If what Christ did wasn’t manipulating energies, I don’t know what is.”

Egad.

There are some religions that work inclusively. Christianity and Islam are not them. Islam makes some bit of noise about accepting Christ as a prophet but requires denying the deity of Christ.

That doesn’t work with Christianity which demands Christ and God are the same person (regardless if one goes for “oneness” or the “trinity.”) But more than that, the purpose of the cross and resurrection defines Christianity. Deny that and you’re a Christian in name only, attending a social club for whatever reason.

Christianity isn’t about being spiritual. It’s not about what we do, or how we feel, or belonging, or helping others. It’s about what Christ did for us, quite apart from our acceptance of that or if we approve or find prayer emotionally moving or want to dedicate our life to helping others.

By: fapo

fapo — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 16:49:50 +0000

Peter, you should go to an Roman Catholic service some time. If you set aside the restrictions on priesthood and the issue of abortion and Episcopalians are in virtual lock step with respect to adopting “progressive” causes. Services are virtually identical.

Episcopalians are universally boring and politically clueless. They have been this way for a very long time.

By: sonicfrog

sonicfrog — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 16:07:12 +0000

Is it appropriate to thank God for being agnostic and avoiding all this religion mess?

By: Peter Hughes

Peter Hughes — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:51:50 +0000

Speaking as an Eastern Orthodox, I am constantly amazed at how much the Protestant branch of Christianity seems to bend and sway with every passing breeze. I am also concerned that some of these denominations are more concerned with this life than the next.

I once attended a UMC service with Hubby (who had studied at SMU for the clergy but abandoned it), and I was taken aback by the out-and-out hypocrisy on the part of the clergy and its parishioners. For starters, they would “pray for all,” but then turn around and sideswipe those who opposed their beliefs. In fact, on the Sunday that I attended, it was the day after Reagan’s funeral. The out-and-out hostility on the part of the lay leader’s prayer was so thick you could cut it with a knife.

Give me a Greek or Russian Orthodox service any day. At least it has withstood persecution, pestilence, jihad, crusades, world wars and other of man’s ills. But that’s just my $0.02, guys and gals.

Regards,
Peter H.

By: Roberto

Roberto — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 14:58:01 +0000

I knew ECUSA was on the road to perdition in 1976 when the ordination of women took place in the Church of the Advocate in Philadelphia. I became aware that liberalism was infecting the church in 1960. Prior to then, as a postulant for Holy Orders, I used to attend Evensong at the seminary. The faculty had a reputation for being Anglo-Catholic. When I entered in 1960 there had been some changes and they were the liberals. The professor of dogmatics who I knew to be an A,C,had changed his tune and say ¨I , as a Protestant . . . ¨ A visiting professor of church history, Fr. C. Preston Wiles, suggested to the class that we become members in the ACLU. ECUSA is now reaping the seeds sown back then. Everytime I read an article such as this, I shake my head and am glad I left the church when I did.

By: Pamela

Pamela — Tue, 19 Jun 2007 06:17:32 +0000

oh lordi, has this tool read the koran? As a woman she is worth less than a man, as a Christain she is a dhimmi and must pay jaziya.

Unbeleivably naive. hope the crocodile eats you last, but will prob eat you first since you’ll be an easy mark.

Left the Epsicopal church longtime ago.