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	<title>Comments on: Some Log Cabin Splinters</title>
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	<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/</link>
	<description>The Internet home for American gay conservatives.</description>
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		<title>By: ILoveCapitalism</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73621</link>
		<dc:creator>ILoveCapitalism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Feb 2008 07:03:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73621</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;But LCRs have never been anything but a more liberal, progressive or moderate element in the GOP... I’m not a supporter of LCRs.&lt;/blockquote&gt;I agree with the first bit, and therefore, I don&#039;t get the second bit.  Remember MM, &quot;conservative&quot; has been a dirty word for you, in many of your GP blog comments.  Come to think of it, &quot;conservative&quot; is a slightly-dirty word for you even here, in this thread.  You say:&lt;blockquote&gt;the purported “conservative” agenda doesn’t embrace... anything close to toleration. Just ask Hispanics.&lt;/blockquote&gt;Thus hinting at the Ian-like canard I&#039;ve seen you expound in other discussions, that conservatives are all racists at heart, yadda yadda yadda.&lt;blockquote&gt;their turncoat decision not to endorse Bush 43 for reelection in 2000 [sic; 2004]&lt;/blockquote&gt;Oh, there it is.  I see now.  You disagree with LCR&#039;s party disloyalty.  Hmm, one could almost say you, ah, want to impose a loyalty test on them. ;-)

Personally, I&#039;ll never forget meeting a prominent local (to L.A. area) LCR couple at a certain party and hearing them say &quot;Don&#039;t worry, we&#039;re a social group and all about having fun and political moderation; we never get into conservative ideas.&quot;  I thought, ...and you think that&#039;s a good thing?  a reason I should like you?  LOL</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>But LCRs have never been anything but a more liberal, progressive or moderate element in the GOP&#8230; I’m not a supporter of LCRs.</p></blockquote>
<p>I agree with the first bit, and therefore, I don&#8217;t get the second bit.  Remember MM, &#8220;conservative&#8221; has been a dirty word for you, in many of your GP blog comments.  Come to think of it, &#8220;conservative&#8221; is a slightly-dirty word for you even here, in this thread.  You say:<br />
<blockquote>the purported “conservative” agenda doesn’t embrace&#8230; anything close to toleration. Just ask Hispanics.</p></blockquote>
<p>Thus hinting at the Ian-like canard I&#8217;ve seen you expound in other discussions, that conservatives are all racists at heart, yadda yadda yadda.<br />
<blockquote>their turncoat decision not to endorse Bush 43 for reelection in 2000 [sic; 2004]</p></blockquote>
<p>Oh, there it is.  I see now.  You disagree with LCR&#8217;s party disloyalty.  Hmm, one could almost say you, ah, want to impose a loyalty test on them. <img src='http://www.gaypatriot.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Personally, I&#8217;ll never forget meeting a prominent local (to L.A. area) LCR couple at a certain party and hearing them say &#8220;Don&#8217;t worry, we&#8217;re a social group and all about having fun and political moderation; we never get into conservative ideas.&#8221;  I thought, &#8230;and you think that&#8217;s a good thing?  a reason I should like you?  LOL</p>
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		<title>By: Geena the transgirl</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73620</link>
		<dc:creator>Geena the transgirl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Feb 2008 06:47:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73620</guid>
		<description>Romney can&#039;t poll out of the 30%&#039;s in a match up with Clinton or Obama. With the exception of Michigan, Romney has always finished within 1-2% of his final polling numbers.  Undecideds will not break for Romney, his national negatives are too high.
He would be a reverse coattail disaster for Republicans at all office levels.  The only advantage is he would be the equivalent of a political bear market washout for Republicans, and the only way from there would be up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Romney can&#8217;t poll out of the 30%&#8217;s in a match up with Clinton or Obama. With the exception of Michigan, Romney has always finished within 1-2% of his final polling numbers.  Undecideds will not break for Romney, his national negatives are too high.<br />
He would be a reverse coattail disaster for Republicans at all office levels.  The only advantage is he would be the equivalent of a political bear market washout for Republicans, and the only way from there would be up.</p>
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		<title>By: Ted B. (Charging Rhino)</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73631</link>
		<dc:creator>Ted B. (Charging Rhino)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 22:48:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73631</guid>
		<description>I agree with MichiganMatt, the LCR...and many gay Republiucans aren&#039;t &quot;conservative&quot; Republicans; they&#039;re moderates and progressives  who support smaller government, lower taxes, reasonable support for buisiness and a strong defense.  They may or may-not support the social-conservatives anti-abortion position; BUT that hardly makes them self-loathing homosexuals or &quot;Jewish Nazis&quot;.   (God, I hate that political analogy.)  Why does a Repubican-of-good-conscience HAVE to be a social-conservative?  Why do WE allow the two to be conflated?

As a small busineman, I want lower taxes, greater economic freedom and the government to stay off my back.  I don&#039;t agree with the collectivist labor unions, the NEA, nor the kleptocracy of the Liberal elites; therefor I support the Republicans.  Do I wish they&#039;d layoff the gay-basing and the Fundementalist gay-baiting, of course.  But do I want the liberal-nanny state telling me what I can&#039;t do, while having it&#039;s hand in my pocket everyday picking my wallet and taxing my capital; hell no....

The American political electoral-landscape is polar, you only have two choices.  There are no nice, nuanced splinter-parties like in Europe where you can be a &quot;trimmer&quot;.  You pick the party you can mostly-support, or support the opposition party to the one who can&#039;t agree-with.  When you go into the booth you have to make a choice.  And I strongly feel that a responsible American does not sit-out and election when he doesn&#039;t love his candidate-choices.  It&#039;s your duty to vote, regardless of who&#039;s on the ballot.  If you don&#039;t like either, vote for the less-damaged, the more palatable.  Or in desparation vote AGAINST the one you loathe most.

To paraphrase Mr. Rumsfeld, &lt;i&gt;&quot;...you go into the voting booth with the candidates you have.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

The same with political parties.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with MichiganMatt, the LCR&#8230;and many gay Republiucans aren&#8217;t &#8220;conservative&#8221; Republicans; they&#8217;re moderates and progressives  who support smaller government, lower taxes, reasonable support for buisiness and a strong defense.  They may or may-not support the social-conservatives anti-abortion position; BUT that hardly makes them self-loathing homosexuals or &#8220;Jewish Nazis&#8221;.   (God, I hate that political analogy.)  Why does a Repubican-of-good-conscience HAVE to be a social-conservative?  Why do WE allow the two to be conflated?</p>
<p>As a small busineman, I want lower taxes, greater economic freedom and the government to stay off my back.  I don&#8217;t agree with the collectivist labor unions, the NEA, nor the kleptocracy of the Liberal elites; therefor I support the Republicans.  Do I wish they&#8217;d layoff the gay-basing and the Fundementalist gay-baiting, of course.  But do I want the liberal-nanny state telling me what I can&#8217;t do, while having it&#8217;s hand in my pocket everyday picking my wallet and taxing my capital; hell no&#8230;.</p>
<p>The American political electoral-landscape is polar, you only have two choices.  There are no nice, nuanced splinter-parties like in Europe where you can be a &#8220;trimmer&#8221;.  You pick the party you can mostly-support, or support the opposition party to the one who can&#8217;t agree-with.  When you go into the booth you have to make a choice.  And I strongly feel that a responsible American does not sit-out and election when he doesn&#8217;t love his candidate-choices.  It&#8217;s your duty to vote, regardless of who&#8217;s on the ballot.  If you don&#8217;t like either, vote for the less-damaged, the more palatable.  Or in desparation vote AGAINST the one you loathe most.</p>
<p>To paraphrase Mr. Rumsfeld, <i>&#8220;&#8230;you go into the voting booth with the candidates you have.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>The same with political parties.</p>
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		<title>By: Michigan-Matt</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73630</link>
		<dc:creator>Michigan-Matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 19:23:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73630</guid>
		<description>Back on topic... Bruce, I appreciate your scorn at the LCRs seeming or unseamly turn toward supporting McCain now that the moderate-2-progressive Giuilani is out of contention as Prez nominee... but the part of your post that has me wondering is your contention that the LCR ought to be conservative.  Conservative?  Really?

Right, I know you had some &quot;come-to-Jesus&quot; discussions with the LCR&#039;s exec dir and he contended he was a conservative... or something to that effect.  But LCRs have never been anything but a more liberal, progressive or moderate element in the GOP.  They&#039;ve never been conservative because the purported &quot;conservative&quot; agenda doesn&#039;t embrace sexual diversity and equal civil rights... let alone, anything close to toleration.  Just ask Hispanics.  Or Blacks.  Or Muslims.  Or lower income families.  Or labor.

I wonder why, now, you seemed surprised at the LCRs drift toward John McCain in a ditch to embrace someone who at least appears not to harbor resentment and antipathy toward gays, gay GOPers, and moderates.  They aren&#039;t conservative and to suppose their spokecharacter&#039;s attestation to you that they might be anything other than moderate to progressive is, frankly, just wishful thinking.  Should they work with conservative leaders in the GOP?  Sure.  Should they support the move to moderation in the Party?  You bet!  It makes more sense given their historic role in the Party.

Don&#039;t get me wrong.  I&#039;m not a supporter of LCRs.  I think they still ought to stand out in the field of political inconsequence for a few more years after their turncoat decision not to endorse Bush 43 for reelection in 2000.

But to think they should be conservative would be like expecting a group like NOW in the Democrativ Party to re-engage the political reality of the 21st Century and embrace the value of stay-at-home moms.  It ain&#039;t going to happen.

The LCR can&#039;t be conservative... please insert here a cliche about leopard and spots.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Back on topic&#8230; Bruce, I appreciate your scorn at the LCRs seeming or unseamly turn toward supporting McCain now that the moderate-2-progressive Giuilani is out of contention as Prez nominee&#8230; but the part of your post that has me wondering is your contention that the LCR ought to be conservative.  Conservative?  Really?</p>
<p>Right, I know you had some &#8220;come-to-Jesus&#8221; discussions with the LCR&#8217;s exec dir and he contended he was a conservative&#8230; or something to that effect.  But LCRs have never been anything but a more liberal, progressive or moderate element in the GOP.  They&#8217;ve never been conservative because the purported &#8220;conservative&#8221; agenda doesn&#8217;t embrace sexual diversity and equal civil rights&#8230; let alone, anything close to toleration.  Just ask Hispanics.  Or Blacks.  Or Muslims.  Or lower income families.  Or labor.</p>
<p>I wonder why, now, you seemed surprised at the LCRs drift toward John McCain in a ditch to embrace someone who at least appears not to harbor resentment and antipathy toward gays, gay GOPers, and moderates.  They aren&#8217;t conservative and to suppose their spokecharacter&#8217;s attestation to you that they might be anything other than moderate to progressive is, frankly, just wishful thinking.  Should they work with conservative leaders in the GOP?  Sure.  Should they support the move to moderation in the Party?  You bet!  It makes more sense given their historic role in the Party.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t get me wrong.  I&#8217;m not a supporter of LCRs.  I think they still ought to stand out in the field of political inconsequence for a few more years after their turncoat decision not to endorse Bush 43 for reelection in 2000.</p>
<p>But to think they should be conservative would be like expecting a group like NOW in the Democrativ Party to re-engage the political reality of the 21st Century and embrace the value of stay-at-home moms.  It ain&#8217;t going to happen.</p>
<p>The LCR can&#8217;t be conservative&#8230; please insert here a cliche about leopard and spots.</p>
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		<title>By: PatriotPartner</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73629</link>
		<dc:creator>PatriotPartner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 18:10:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73629</guid>
		<description>The way I look at is McCain has screwed me several times in the past, has done it badly, is still proud of his performance and then calls me just a &quot;friend&quot; every time I see him.

It&#039;s time to let someone else have a go at it. Romney...You&#039;re up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The way I look at is McCain has screwed me several times in the past, has done it badly, is still proud of his performance and then calls me just a &#8220;friend&#8221; every time I see him.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s time to let someone else have a go at it. Romney&#8230;You&#8217;re up.</p>
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		<title>By: national razor</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73628</link>
		<dc:creator>national razor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 17:34:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73628</guid>
		<description>okay, romney doesn&#039;t like us, but i don&#039;t care.  i am still a conservative and john mccain is NOT.  if i was going to choose a candidate based only on his stance on gay issues, i would vote for kucinich.

we cant be one issue voters!  mitt romney is all we have left! (gulp)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>okay, romney doesn&#8217;t like us, but i don&#8217;t care.  i am still a conservative and john mccain is NOT.  if i was going to choose a candidate based only on his stance on gay issues, i would vote for kucinich.</p>
<p>we cant be one issue voters!  mitt romney is all we have left! (gulp)</p>
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		<title>By: Ted B. (Charging Rhino)</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73627</link>
		<dc:creator>Ted B. (Charging Rhino)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 17:25:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73627</guid>
		<description>I have to decide in the next week, and I&#039;m still divided.  McCain&#039;s made an aweful lot of political compromises over the years, yet I fear that Romney&#039;s merely posing as a (social) conservative out of expediency.  Neither has a very good track-record as a fiscal-conservative, as a friend to (small) business, nor as a friend of the G/L community.  Yet I reject the meme that one must be a rock-rib conservative to be a Republican...especially as that veres dangerously-close to be a social-right anti-gay, anti-abortion bigot.  Smaller government, lower taxes and a strong defense trump these regardless of &quot;label&quot;.

It gets back to my initial analysis from last year;  McCain too-old and politically-compromised, and Romney&#039;s too-unprincipled and unelectable.  Huckebee not-so-secretly despises the gays and Paul wears a tin-foil hat.

At this rate, maybe I&#039;lll invest in Aluminum futures next week....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to decide in the next week, and I&#8217;m still divided.  McCain&#8217;s made an aweful lot of political compromises over the years, yet I fear that Romney&#8217;s merely posing as a (social) conservative out of expediency.  Neither has a very good track-record as a fiscal-conservative, as a friend to (small) business, nor as a friend of the G/L community.  Yet I reject the meme that one must be a rock-rib conservative to be a Republican&#8230;especially as that veres dangerously-close to be a social-right anti-gay, anti-abortion bigot.  Smaller government, lower taxes and a strong defense trump these regardless of &#8220;label&#8221;.</p>
<p>It gets back to my initial analysis from last year;  McCain too-old and politically-compromised, and Romney&#8217;s too-unprincipled and unelectable.  Huckebee not-so-secretly despises the gays and Paul wears a tin-foil hat.</p>
<p>At this rate, maybe I&#8217;lll invest in Aluminum futures next week&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Leah</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73626</link>
		<dc:creator>Leah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 17:24:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73626</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote cite=&quot;&quot;&gt;Please touch base with all of your friends and fellow bloggers in the Tuesday primary states and suggest that they vote for Romney. He is our only alternative&lt;/blockquote&gt;
That is good advice, there still is a chance for change on super Tuesday.
On the other hand, not voting for McCain in November may make you feel good, but is not good for the country.

Victor David Hanson puts it far better than I could:
&lt;blockquote cite=&quot;&quot;&gt;If McCain gets the nomination, I would have to believe that the Republican sit-out would only last midsummer until they could not take Sen. Clinton  no more, and thus like Lancelot at Camlan belatedly enter the fray.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote cite=""><p>Please touch base with all of your friends and fellow bloggers in the Tuesday primary states and suggest that they vote for Romney. He is our only alternative</p></blockquote>
<p>That is good advice, there still is a chance for change on super Tuesday.<br />
On the other hand, not voting for McCain in November may make you feel good, but is not good for the country.</p>
<p>Victor David Hanson puts it far better than I could:</p>
<blockquote cite=""><p>If McCain gets the nomination, I would have to believe that the Republican sit-out would only last midsummer until they could not take Sen. Clinton  no more, and thus like Lancelot at Camlan belatedly enter the fray.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Justin Wong</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73625</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Wong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 17:19:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73625</guid>
		<description>Yes, and how&#039;s Romney&#039;s record on gay issues?  While he was actively testifying on Capitol Hill in favor of the Federal Marriage Amendment, McCain voted against it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, and how&#8217;s Romney&#8217;s record on gay issues?  While he was actively testifying on Capitol Hill in favor of the Federal Marriage Amendment, McCain voted against it.</p>
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		<title>By: Raging Moderate</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73624</link>
		<dc:creator>Raging Moderate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 16:24:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73624</guid>
		<description>Sit at home in November? Seems that whenever moderates say that about ultra conservative nominees we get cvalled RINO&#039;s. I guess the horn is on the other forehead now. Sitting at home is a vote for Hillary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sit at home in November? Seems that whenever moderates say that about ultra conservative nominees we get cvalled RINO&#8217;s. I guess the horn is on the other forehead now. Sitting at home is a vote for Hillary.</p>
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		<title>By: PatriotMom</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73623</link>
		<dc:creator>PatriotMom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 16:17:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73623</guid>
		<description>Please touch base with all of your friends and fellow bloggers in the Tuesday primary states and suggest that they vote for Romney. He is our only alternative.......McCain is not a Republican candidate that I as a lifelong R can vote for, and I may also be sitting home in November.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please touch base with all of your friends and fellow bloggers in the Tuesday primary states and suggest that they vote for Romney. He is our only alternative&#8230;&#8230;.McCain is not a Republican candidate that I as a lifelong R can vote for, and I may also be sitting home in November.</p>
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		<title>By: Crow</title>
		<link>http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/02/01/some-log-cabin-splinters/comment-page-1/#comment-73622</link>
		<dc:creator>Crow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 15:29:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gaypatriot.net/?p=2804#comment-73622</guid>
		<description>&quot;It truly proves that the organization is NOT comprised of gay conservatives at all.&quot;

http://gaypatriot.net/2008/01/24/bolton-to-speak-at-log-cabin-convention

Well, now I&#039;m sort of confused about what Gay Patriot&#039;s position on the LCR are.  (Not is, right, because Republicans is plural?  Still sounds wrong.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It truly proves that the organization is NOT comprised of gay conservatives at all.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://gaypatriot.net/2008/01/24/bolton-to-speak-at-log-cabin-convention" rel="nofollow">http://gaypatriot.net/2008/01/24/bolton-to-speak-at-log-cabin-convention</a></p>
<p>Well, now I&#8217;m sort of confused about what Gay Patriot&#8217;s position on the LCR are.  (Not is, right, because Republicans is plural?  Still sounds wrong.)</p>
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