Comments on: How Some Gays Fight Terror in Iraq http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/ The Internet home for American gay conservatives. Fri, 10 Feb 2012 19:00:47 -0700 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: ILoveCapitalism http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-126099 ILoveCapitalism Sat, 05 Apr 2008 21:34:35 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-126099 <blockquote>The only "power" I’ve ever truly longed for was power over my own life, and to be left alone to live free.</blockquote>Same here.

The only "power" I’ve ever truly longed for was power over my own life, and to be left alone to live free.

Same here.

]]> By: Craig http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-125191 Craig Fri, 04 Apr 2008 22:45:29 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-125191 I just wanted to thank all of you for your thoughtful comments. I think the "power over others" argument may, in the end, be true. It just seems like such a damn cynical view of our fellow Man. But, it really is the only thing that explains the behavior. The only "power" I've ever truly longed for was power over my ownlife, and to be left alone to live free. As a business owner, I've been accused of the typical "greedy, selfishness, power-hungry" standard drivel, when in reality, I never sought the power to control those who I employ, but just a fair exchange of value to mutual benefit so I could live my life as I saw fit. Thanks again, Fellas[?] :-) I just wanted to thank all of you for your thoughtful comments. I think the "power over others" argument may, in the end, be true. It just seems like such a damn cynical view of our fellow Man. But, it really is the only thing that explains the behavior. The only "power" I’ve ever truly longed for was power over my ownlife, and to be left alone to live free. As a business owner, I’ve been accused of the typical "greedy, selfishness, power-hungry" standard drivel, when in reality, I never sought the power to control those who I employ, but just a fair exchange of value to mutual benefit so I could live my life as I saw fit.
Thanks again, Fellas[?] :-)

]]> By: North Dallas Thirty http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-125109 North Dallas Thirty Fri, 04 Apr 2008 21:42:07 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-125109 How is it that some PC-flavor-of-the-day override an apparent life-long commitment to a valid, principled moral issue? In my opinion, Craig, it's because these groups use minority rights, not as a cause or principle, but as a shield and smokescreen for leftist and antisocial beliefs. Irrational hatred of men is more palatable cloaked in the guise of "feminism". Promiscuity is easier to swallow when phrased as "gay rights". How is it that some PC-flavor-of-the-day override an apparent life-long commitment to a valid, principled moral issue?

In my opinion, Craig, it’s because these groups use minority rights, not as a cause or principle, but as a shield and smokescreen for leftist and antisocial beliefs.

Irrational hatred of men is more palatable cloaked in the guise of "feminism".

Promiscuity is easier to swallow when phrased as "gay rights".

]]> By: Leah http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124914 Leah Fri, 04 Apr 2008 16:29:24 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124914 ILC and Helio said it perfectly. I second their opinion. One thing I'd add. The far left does not believe in any higher power, so of course they want it for themselves. Many moderates or people on the Right believe in some kind of God figure. Which means we as humans have to answer to a higher authority and aren't looking for ultimate power for ourselves. ILC and Helio said it perfectly. I second their opinion. One thing I’d add. The far left does not believe in any higher power, so of course they want it for themselves.
Many moderates or people on the Right believe in some kind of God figure. Which means we as humans have to answer to a higher authority and aren’t looking for ultimate power for ourselves.

]]> By: Crow http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124841 Crow Fri, 04 Apr 2008 15:02:27 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124841 Re TGC, post 12, what the hell are you talking about? Re TGC, post 12, what the hell are you talking about?

]]> By: heliotrope http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124487 heliotrope Fri, 04 Apr 2008 02:39:19 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124487 Ditto to the comments by ILC.  Ditto to the comments by ILC. 

]]> By: ILoveCapitalism http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124391 ILoveCapitalism Thu, 03 Apr 2008 23:50:32 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124391 <blockquote>Just raw power? Does such a thing exist?</blockquote>I would say yes. Raw power over other human beings. To what end? I don't know for sure, but why would anybody love power over others' lives? To make themselves feel better. To make 'oppressive' distinctions meaningless. They can't achieve economically (say) - but they can rule over the people who do. They can't achieve morally or spiritually (say) - but they can tear down, denigrate or even stigmatize the people who do. That's my view of the committed Left. (Not the average person-in-the-street-who-thinks-they're-liberal, mind you.) Call me cynical - I mean, how could anyone accuse other human beings of being that nasty? - but it's the conclusion I reached, after pondering the questions you raise.

Just raw power? Does such a thing exist?

I would say yes. Raw power over other human beings. To what end? I don’t know for sure, but why would anybody love power over others’ lives? To make themselves feel better. To make ‘oppressive’ distinctions meaningless. They can’t achieve economically (say) – but they can rule over the people who do. They can’t achieve morally or spiritually (say) – but they can tear down, denigrate or even stigmatize the people who do.

That’s my view of the committed Left. (Not the average person-in-the-street-who-thinks-they’re-liberal, mind you.) Call me cynical – I mean, how could anyone accuse other human beings of being that nasty? – but it’s the conclusion I reached, after pondering the questions you raise.

]]> By: Craig http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124386 Craig Thu, 03 Apr 2008 23:39:56 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124386 Helio,To what end ? For what purpose? Power to do what? Just raw power? Does such a thing exist? If so, that is an extremely malevolent worldview. Don’t they have some ultimate purpose beyond their own self-aggrandizement? Helio,To what end ? For what purpose? Power to do what? Just raw power? Does such a thing exist? If so, that is an extremely malevolent worldview. Don’t they have some ultimate purpose beyond their own self-aggrandizement?

]]> By: ILoveCapitalism http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124384 ILoveCapitalism Thu, 03 Apr 2008 23:37:15 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124384 Craig - what I call the "far Left" or "committed Left" is simply not about consistency.  IMO, anyone who wants to understand their deeper motivations must view this speech by Evan Sayet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaE98w1KZ-c In a nutshell, their deep motivation is a belief that all distinctions of right and wrong, good and evil, legal and illegal, etc. should be torn down, because *nothing* is worth fighting or dying for.  Nothing is authentically good or evil; except themselves who are 'wise' enough to know that, and who should therefore be brought to power, or made the rulers.  So their driving, twin motivations are (1) to tear down distinctions of right/wrong, good/evil, etc. and (2) to gain, keep or expand their own political power. But Sayet says it better. Craig – what I call the "far Left" or "committed Left" is simply not about consistency.  IMO, anyone who wants to understand their deeper motivations must view this speech by Evan Sayet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaE98w1KZ-c

In a nutshell, their deep motivation is a belief that all distinctions of right and wrong, good and evil, legal and illegal, etc. should be torn down, because *nothing* is worth fighting or dying for.  Nothing is authentically good or evil; except themselves who are ‘wise’ enough to know that, and who should therefore be brought to power, or made the rulers.  So their driving, twin motivations are (1) to tear down distinctions of right/wrong, good/evil, etc. and (2) to gain, keep or expand their own political power.

But Sayet says it better.

]]> By: heliotrope http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124383 heliotrope Thu, 03 Apr 2008 23:33:07 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124383 Craig, if I may interrupt, ...... "What does it say about the Left's leaders?" ....... They are whores for power.  I, too, am a straight who finds great sanity and common sense on this site. While all politics is a fight for control, it is the leftists who will engage the fight with no holds barred. Feminists will eat their own young if it will protect their sugar daddy. Liberal gays love being told they are being mentioned in the prayers of their atheist party leaders.  I am patiently waiting for the "Gays for Islam" chapter to form. If it does, count on the Democrat Left to encourage them to form up and take a lemming dive off the cliffs. Craig, if I may interrupt, …… "What does it say about the Left’s leaders?" ……. They are whores for power.

 I, too, am a straight who finds great sanity and common sense on this site. While all politics is a fight for control, it is the leftists who will engage the fight with no holds barred. Feminists will eat their own young if it will protect their sugar daddy. Liberal gays love being told they are being mentioned in the prayers of their atheist party leaders. 

I am patiently waiting for the "Gays for Islam" chapter to form. If it does, count on the Democrat Left to encourage them to form up and take a lemming dive off the cliffs.

]]> By: Craig http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124365 Craig Thu, 03 Apr 2008 22:59:51 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124365 I appreciate your comments NDT, and I’m interested in your thoughts on “their” motivation.  I can remember in my naïve younger days when the Monica story broke; I thought to myself “that’s it, he’s toast. The feminists are going to destroy him for such a blatant violation of their foundational principles.”  You may recall, this period as the height of the feminists’ movements attempts at defining ANY sexual relationship (de facto harassment) between a male in a position of power over a subordinate (even consensual.) Thus, I thought, “this is it; they’re going to turn on him.” Then nothing. Absolute silence. How could this be? From that point on I’ve been straining to understand the underlying principles/motivations of movement leaders of the Left. What do they stand for? What motivates them? What are their underlying principles/motivations?  These are not rhetorical questions. I’m really trying to understand the true beliefs of these various ferocious movement leaders for: Gay Rights, Women’s Rights, Children’s rights, Minority Rights; who seem to have such principled and moral convictions about important issues, but simply look away when the oppressors are from some favored PC group.  How is it that some PC-flavor-of-the-day override an apparent life-long commitment to a valid, principled moral issue? I’ve had my disagreements with various identity-politicos of the Left, but I never doubted their commitment to their cause; although I would argue about redefining marriage, and agree with civil unions, I never thought my interlocutors would change their position (or fall silent) if my name was Mohammed instead of just plain-old Craig. What does this mean? What does this say about the Left’s leaders? I appreciate your comments NDT, and I’m interested in your thoughts on “their” motivation.  I can remember in my naïve younger days when the Monica story broke; I thought to myself “that’s it, he’s toast. The feminists are going to destroy him for such a blatant violation of their foundational principles.”  You may recall, this period as the height of the feminists’ movements attempts at defining ANY sexual relationship (de facto harassment) between a male in a position of power over a subordinate (even consensual.) Thus, I thought, “this is it; they’re going to turn on him.” Then nothing. Absolute silence. How could this be? From that point on I’ve been straining to understand the underlying principles/motivations of movement leaders of the Left. What do they stand for? What motivates them? What are their underlying principles/motivations?  These are not rhetorical questions. I’m really trying to understand the true beliefs of these various ferocious movement leaders for: Gay Rights, Women’s Rights, Children’s rights, Minority Rights; who seem to have such principled and moral convictions about important issues, but simply look away when the oppressors are from some favored PC group.  How is it that some PC-flavor-of-the-day override an apparent life-long commitment to a valid, principled moral issue? I’ve had my disagreements with various identity-politicos of the Left, but I never doubted their commitment to their cause; although I would argue about redefining marriage, and agree with civil unions, I never thought my interlocutors would change their position (or fall silent) if my name was Mohammed instead of just plain-old Craig. What does this mean? What does this say about the Left’s leaders?

]]> By: North Dallas Thirty http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124345 North Dallas Thirty Thu, 03 Apr 2008 22:18:14 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124345 Yes, Craig, it is a fallacy that being gay or lesbian automatically turns you into a screaming anti-American leftist. :) But, since it provides a convenient smokescreen for people to hide anti-Americanism and leftist beliefs under the guise of "gay rights", that's mostly what you see. It's similar to the fact that the vast majority of black churches do not scream "God damn America" or insist that the US deserved 9/11; however, because it's useful to Democrat Party candidates to argue that to make their "spiritual advisors" appear normal, that's what the media reports. Yes, Craig, it is a fallacy that being gay or lesbian automatically turns you into a screaming anti-American leftist. :)

But, since it provides a convenient smokescreen for people to hide anti-Americanism and leftist beliefs under the guise of "gay rights", that’s mostly what you see.

It’s similar to the fact that the vast majority of black churches do not scream "God damn America" or insist that the US deserved 9/11; however, because it’s useful to Democrat Party candidates to argue that to make their "spiritual advisors" appear normal, that’s what the media reports.

]]> By: Craig http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124315 Craig Thu, 03 Apr 2008 21:27:56 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124315 As a straight guy, I’m very encouraged by the majority of the comments on this thread. Why don’t we see any of your voices being heard in the media? (I know, stupid rhetorical question) But seriously, this truly ought to be the defining Liberal cause of our time. Gays, Feminist, child-advocates, really should be united, and the loudest voices protesting Islam in general; Not just the racial form. My 13 year-old daughter has a playmate from a “moderate” Muslim family whose older sister just entered into an arranged marriage.  This is happening here in a conservative Chicago suburb. Where are the cries from feminist and child-advocates? How can these young girls/women resist their oppressors, when the society at large looks away? This is only going to get worse as long as the traditional Liberal establishment sits on the sidelines. As a straight guy, I’m very encouraged by the majority of the comments on this thread. Why don’t we see any of your voices being heard in the media? (I know, stupid rhetorical question) But seriously, this truly ought to be the defining Liberal cause of our time. Gays, Feminist, child-advocates, really should be united, and the loudest voices protesting Islam in general; Not just the racial form. My 13 year-old daughter has a playmate from a “moderate” Muslim family whose older sister just entered into an arranged marriage.  This is happening here in a conservative Chicago suburb. Where are the cries from feminist and child-advocates? How can these young girls/women resist their oppressors, when the society at large looks away? This is only going to get worse as long as the traditional Liberal establishment sits on the sidelines.

]]> By: ThatGayConservative http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124296 ThatGayConservative Thu, 03 Apr 2008 20:43:56 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124296 <em>There have also been allegations and rumors about the PLO-Fattah leadership and their boy-toys both in the Western press </em>Wasn't Anderson Vanderbilt 360 all over that during the war 2 summers ago? There have also been allegations and rumors about the PLO-Fattah leadership and their boy-toys both in the Western press

Wasn’t Anderson Vanderbilt 360 all over that during the war 2 summers ago?

]]> By: Gays Fight Terror in Iraq: http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124284 Gays Fight Terror in Iraq: Thu, 03 Apr 2008 20:23:00 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124284 [...] admin • April 3, 2008 From GayPatriot.net: It’s not just one gay pornographer standing up to Islamofascism. Now we learn of gay informants [...] [...] admin • April 3, 2008 From GayPatriot.net: It’s not just one gay pornographer standing up to Islamofascism. Now we learn of gay informants [...]

]]> By: Leah http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124091 Leah Thu, 03 Apr 2008 16:50:05 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124091 <blockquote cite="">We may not approve of their choice of lovers,</blockquote cite=""> I don't think these brave Iraqis chose those lovers. In the restrictive world that is Islam, there are few choices. For all those powerful men who use the brothels, the gay sex and the underage children - it's not about lust it's about power. Its' the dominating and humiliating a 'lesser' human being. Which makes the fact that these men came forward to the Americans all the more sweet. They aren't turning in their lovers, they are turning in their tormentors. <blockquote cite="">We may not approve of their choice of lovers,</blockquote cite="">

I don’t think these brave Iraqis chose those lovers. In the restrictive world that is Islam, there are few choices.

For all those powerful men who use the brothels, the gay sex and the underage children – it’s not about lust it’s about power. Its’ the dominating and humiliating a ‘lesser’ human being.

Which makes the fact that these men came forward to the Americans all the more sweet. They aren’t turning in their lovers, they are turning in their tormentors.

]]> By: GayPatriot http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124090 GayPatriot Thu, 03 Apr 2008 16:49:43 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124090 <em>Anyone who is willfully ignorant of this barbaric use of religion is a tool of the offender and little more than a succulent in his garden waiting to be picked. Any man being mounted and hearing the cry of "Allahu Akbar" at the moment of gratification should expect the feel of a dull knife being drawn across his throat.</em> Whoa!   To ... the... point! Anyone who is willfully ignorant of this barbaric use of religion is a tool of the offender and little more than a succulent in his garden waiting to be picked. Any man being mounted and hearing the cry of "Allahu Akbar" at the moment of gratification should expect the feel of a dull knife being drawn across his throat.

Whoa!   To … the… point!

]]> By: Ted B. (Charging Rhino) http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124046 Ted B. (Charging Rhino) Thu, 03 Apr 2008 16:06:27 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124046 There have also been allegations and rumors about the PLO-Fattah leadership and their boy-toys both in the Western press and from Hamas.  The "unclean recreations" of the Fattah leadership in Gaza was one of Hamas' rallying-cries when they drove Fattah out of power there.  And there were the curious reports of naked but gagged adolescent boys being tossed out of 10, 15-story windows at several Fattah headquarters in Gaza when Hamas took-over that were never placed in any context by the media.  A strange form of punishment when Fattah-men were routiunely being shot upon capture....  Fattah eliminating any witnesses?  Or Hamas conducting a ritual cleansing afterwards? There have also been allegations and rumors about the PLO-Fattah leadership and their boy-toys both in the Western press and from Hamas.  The "unclean recreations" of the Fattah leadership in Gaza was one of Hamas’ rallying-cries when they drove Fattah out of power there.  And there were the curious reports of naked but gagged adolescent boys being tossed out of 10, 15-story windows at several Fattah headquarters in Gaza when Hamas took-over that were never placed in any context by the media.  A strange form of punishment when Fattah-men were routiunely being shot upon capture….  Fattah eliminating any witnesses?  Or Hamas conducting a ritual cleansing afterwards?

]]> By: megapotamus http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-124042 megapotamus Thu, 03 Apr 2008 15:58:18 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-124042 There is a deep and violent resistance to public homosexuality in the Arab/Muslim world cohabiting with endemic homosexual practices that are of a piece with anti-female provisions of sharia. It would be hard to design, outside a prison or ship at sea, a social order more segregating from the opposite sex than sharia, yet homosexuality as well as masturbation or even viewing pornography are capital crimes. Think of what daily life is like, not for homosexuals only but for ANYone who does not adhere to the looney cannon of sharia's sexual prohibitions. This is slavery. It cannot persist indefinitely unless it subsumes us, at the least. Shall we at least put up a bit of a struggle first? For appearances? Why not. There is a deep and violent resistance to public homosexuality in the Arab/Muslim world cohabiting with endemic homosexual practices that are of a piece with anti-female provisions of sharia. It would be hard to design, outside a prison or ship at sea, a social order more segregating from the opposite sex than sharia, yet homosexuality as well as masturbation or even viewing pornography are capital crimes. Think of what daily life is like, not for homosexuals only but for ANYone who does not adhere to the looney cannon of sharia’s sexual prohibitions. This is slavery. It cannot persist indefinitely unless it subsumes us, at the least. Shall we at least put up a bit of a struggle first? For appearances? Why not.

]]> By: Brutus http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-123996 Brutus Thu, 03 Apr 2008 15:14:37 +0000 http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/04/02/how-some-gays-fight-terror-in-iraq/#comment-123996 Well, #11, up here in the People's Republic of Massachusetts, our brave, 80% Democrat legislature didn't have the guts to vote their alleged views and enact gay marriage, but instead left it to the courts.  My "progressive" rep voted "present" twice instead of standing up for his gay constituency.  Funny thing is, he was only my rep because his predecessor, a closeted gay Republican, decided his marginalization by the Democratic power structure in the House was stifling him and being mayor would be more to his liking.  He eventually came out and for a while was the director of the Log Cabin Republicans. Question-do you all remeber what the "holy warriors of Allah" did on their last night before hijacking the planes on 9/11? Well, #11, up here in the People’s Republic of Massachusetts, our brave, 80% Democrat legislature didn’t have the guts to vote their alleged views and enact gay marriage, but instead left it to the courts.  My "progressive" rep voted "present" twice instead of standing up for his gay constituency.  Funny thing is, he was only my rep because his predecessor, a closeted gay Republican, decided his marginalization by the Democratic power structure in the House was stifling him and being mayor would be more to his liking.  He eventually came out and for a while was the director of the Log Cabin Republicans.

Question-do you all remeber what the "holy warriors of Allah" did on their last night before hijacking the planes on 9/11?

]]>