Straight Writer Decries “Islamist” Intolerance of Gays
It seems that all too often gay political organizations are reluctant to address the anti-gay attitudes at the core of radical Islamism. They seem sometimes to style themselves as a part of a “Coalition of the Oppressed,” allied with all those at odds with Western governments and societies.
But, some do get it, even figures on the left. I take note in particular of blogger Michael Petrelis, very much a man of the left, but unwavering in criticizing human rights groups for neglecting the plight of gays in Iran and committed to standing up for gays persecuted around the globe.
Last night, I read of literary figure who gets it as well. Ian McEwan, author of the novel which inspired last year’s Oscar-nominated movie Atonement, referenced intolerance toward gays as one of the reasons he despises Islamism:
And I myself despise Islamism, because it wants to create a society that I detest, based on religious belief, on a text, on lack of freedom for women, intolerance towards homosexuality and so on — we know it well.
It’s nice to see a straight literary figure point out something that all too many gay organizations are reluctant to address.
(H/t: The Corner.)
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And related to that, is this article: An Anatomy of Surrender: Motivated by fear and multiculturalism, too many Westerners are acquiescing to creeping sharia.
Comment by V the K — June 24, 2008 @ 2:55 pm - June 24, 2008
To save discussion time, I will pre-emptively post the following bit of dialog:
Left dummy: But how is Islamism any different from “Christianism”?
Answer: A crude change of subject. But OK, find us some “Christianists” who hang gays or blow up people, and we’ll talk.
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — June 24, 2008 @ 2:58 pm - June 24, 2008
ILC: Your clever pre-empting didn’t address what the OP did: Is intolerance towards gays only limited to beatings and beheadings? Is attempting to deny gays the ability to marry, adopt, teach in a school, or serve in the military not intolerance? Or is attempting to create a society that does those things based on a religious text somehow “tolerant” in a conservapedia-style definition of which I am not aware?
Comment by torrentprime — June 24, 2008 @ 3:18 pm - June 24, 2008
Answer: A crude change of subject. But OK, find us some “Christianists†who hang gays or blow up people, and we’ll talk.
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — June 24, 2008 @ 4:07 pm - June 24, 2008
Slightly longer answer:
Correct. They’re not intolerance. You may disagree with them as policies. I know I do (i.e., gays should marry-or-civil-unionize, and serve in the military). But grownups understand that policy differences need not be, and are usually not, a sign of intolerance.
Those things are somewhat more likely to be based on irrational fears, and hence, to be intolerant. But I haven’t heard of anything like that, where I live, since the Briggs Initiative of 1978… which “conservapedia” Ronald Reagan successfully fought **against**. The difference between “Christianists” (real or imagined) and the Islamists, TP, is that even the Christian Reconstruction types accept democracy and the outcomes of elections. Islamists don’t; they’d rather kill you.
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — June 24, 2008 @ 4:16 pm - June 24, 2008
I was going to ask what kind of shallow, navel-gazing drama queen would try and claim that opposition to changing the definition of marriage was equivalent to being butchered, but I was already too late.
Comment by V the K — June 24, 2008 @ 4:59 pm - June 24, 2008
I want to try a little thought experiment. (Won’t work with the left-wing narcissists, but for everybody else…) Imagine Fred Phelps had not been cast out of the Baptist church and reduced to a kooky cult consisting mainly of his own family members. Imagine, instead, he was a religious authority within his faith, who had thousands of people attending his weekly services to hear his calls for burning homosexuals. Then, imagine that reporters from the BBC, the New York Times, and other MSM outlets profiled him and portrayed him as a respected religious figure for whom the desire to burn gays was just a charming personality quirk.
And imagine further that Fred Phelps (who is an outcast even with the Baptist Church) was but one of many religious figures preaching for the extermination of gays, and the destruction of the United States. And that the MSM and the left-wing intellectual elite insisted that our culture should embrace him, even sacrificing some of our own cherished freedoms, so that Fred Phelps and those like him would not be offended. And imagine that the gay left did not think Fred Phelps was a big deal, and instead tried to silence his critics as “intolerant.”
That scenario I described is exactly how the media, the left elite, and even the gay left treat radical imams who preach an even more radical message than Fred Phelps, and who are backed by vast organizations, and even receive government grants to support them as they spread their hatred.
Some of them even get invited to speak at Columbia U, where students and faculty applaud them.
Comment by V the K — June 24, 2008 @ 5:19 pm - June 24, 2008
Good point, V.
Oh. Are we talking about liberals now???
Comment by ThatGayConservative — June 24, 2008 @ 6:15 pm - June 24, 2008
Furthermore, I thought that liberals were supposed to be more tolerant than everybody else. Now, you say that they’re intolerant, bigot homophobes?
Comment by ThatGayConservative — June 24, 2008 @ 6:16 pm - June 24, 2008
Adding to VtK’s thought… just imagine if ol’ Fred was sitting on billions of barrels of oil and using the proceeds to fund schools and groups in the US that advocate his hateful point of view.
I can disagree with a Christian (and he/she can certainly disagree with me) but I do not feel reluctant to hold and express my opinions; I do not feel threatened. I have disagreed with Christians that are friends.
If I lived in Iran (or Amsterdam, even), I’d be a little on edge.
http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/06/09/dutch-media-also-downplay-amsterdam-gay-bashing/
Comment by Robert — June 24, 2008 @ 10:52 pm - June 24, 2008
I don’t have a problem with gay persons that criticize Christianity because of their anti-gay stances. However, it’s mindboggling when the same people excuse or ignore the behavior of Moslems, who are not only more intolerant of homosexuality, but are more violent against homosexuals.
European countries are going to have to figure out how to deal with the increasing Moslem extremism if they want to retain any of their Western culture.
Comment by Pat — June 25, 2008 @ 7:58 am - June 25, 2008
I can disagree with a Christian (and he/she can certainly disagree with me) but I do not feel reluctant to hold and express my opinions; I do not feel threatened. I have disagreed with Christians that are friends.
And this is the key difference. When we disagree with those some would like to label as being “Christianists”, they’re not apt to inflict violence upon us or drive us into exile. We have a system here that enables us to gain the kind of change we would like to see, even if it isn’t as quickly as we’d hope. That’s not the case where Islamists rule or dominate. There is no moral equivalence between Islamofascists and so-called “Christianists”. Those attempting to claim otherwise only make themselves look foolish.
Comment by John — June 25, 2008 @ 8:30 am - June 25, 2008
I want to bring to your attention a case of initimidation against a straight guy who opposes gay marriage.
There is a blogger who runs a Blog Talk Radio show , Political Pistachio
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/politicalpistachio
[See link for all the dates I will mention here]
Last Tuesday (the 17th) he had a show about the California Same-Sex Marriage ruling. He is against it. He is for Civil Unions
I called in to give voice to those of us gay people who are against this form of Judicial hi-jacking of the political process.
Either that night or the next day , someone found out where he lived.. went to his house, defaced his truck, and through a brick through his front room window with a note threatening to harm his wife.
On the 18th he textually announced he is ceasing all of his blogging and talk radio’ing.
On the 23rd he appeared on the Andrea Shea King show to give an update of what happened
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/askshow
What happened to him is beyond outrageous and when word gets around what happens to people who oppose court-imposed gay marriage, you can expect this will cause a major backlash against gay people.
Comment by Vince P — June 25, 2008 @ 8:40 pm - June 25, 2008
This blog was mentioned on the Andrea Shea King show of the 23rd.
He gave a credit to the people on this blog , he didn’t know that there were gay conservatives or gays who didn’t follow the Gay Left Borg.
Comment by Vince P — June 25, 2008 @ 8:42 pm - June 25, 2008
#3
No. Muslim Imams suggest to their followers that there are subtle ways of punishing gays.. such as .. if the Muslim is a dentist.. he could “forget” to numb the patient when he does something painful.. or pull the wrong tooth. etc.
Comment by Vince P — June 25, 2008 @ 8:50 pm - June 25, 2008
You continue to be dishonest on this issue GPW and I am not amused. Any number of gay publications and bloggers regularly either cover the problems of gay rights abuses in the Islamic world or link to sources that do. You have cherry-picked your sources on this issue in spite of an email exchange pointing you in the direction of better information. Clearly you just don’t want to see it. You should be ashamed.
Yes, we should be paying more attention to these stories. But if Towleroad can link to these stories almost daily, perhaps you could to. In fact, wouldn’t it be a better use of your blog to inform your readers via links to news sources than to chastise those who do not. You don’t either which you so hypocritically fail to mention.
If you want something done, do it yourself. Or at least stop bitching because no one is. Other people are. Lying is beneath you.
Comment by Houndentenor — June 26, 2008 @ 8:42 pm - June 26, 2008
Half a fair point, Houndentenor.
I’m not dishonest on this issue. Here, I single “gay political organizations.” I did not say gay bloggers. You’re right, Towleroad does link these stories on a regular basis. And note that I singled out Michael Petrelis, a gay lefty blogger, in the post itself.
Because he put me on his e-mail list, I get his missives on a regular basis.
Comment by GayPatriotWest — June 27, 2008 @ 3:26 am - June 27, 2008
[...] do have something serious to say. One such critic is Houndentenor who, in esponding to my post, Straight Writer Decries “Islamist†Intolerance of Gays, writes, “Any number of gay publications and bloggers regularly either cover the problems of [...]
Pingback by GayPatriot » Bloggers Addressing Plight of Our Fellows in Islamic Lands — June 27, 2008 @ 12:41 pm - June 27, 2008