One of the greatest things about blogging is the e-mails we get praising us for our work. Â I feel we are accomplishing something when we hear from other gay Republicans (and conservatives) who have (“finally” as some put it) found a forum where others share views similar to their own. Â
It’s also heartening to hear from gay liberals delighted to discover dissent to the gay orthodoxy to which they are accustomed. Â They might not agree with us, but they are want to familiarize themselves with other political perspectives in our community.
And then there are the social conservatives, the evangelicals, who discover us. Â One such individual e-mailed me last week and with his permission, I reprint his e-mail:
Just found your blog, linked from instapundit and barone. Great work!
I have struggled for some time with “gay” issues. I haven’t quite come to terms with how to reconcile my views, being a straight libertarian evangelical Christian, et al, but I prefer to leave that to others more knowledgeable. I have too many good friends who are gay. I care too much about them to just dismiss them, or condemn them.
From what I read so far in your blog/archives, I think your blog will help.
Glad we can help offer a different perspective on gay issues than that offered by the mainstream gay media (MSGM?). Â Truly flattered by this e-mail. Â Thanks!
AMAZING! I suppose it would be okay to beat, tie up, and leave for dead a more ‘flamboyant’ & liberal gay or lesbian but those LCRs, they are all right, just as long as they keep to themselves and don’t demand too much from society. Nice. I am glad you get some sort of sense of pride from being partially accepted (because of your far right extremist views) by those who would sooner see you disappear from the face of the earth than really accept you as a valid human being. I feel sorry for you and gay men and women like you.
My far right extremist views, Liberal?
Evidence that they would sooner see us disappear from the face of the earth? Or is yours just an angry rant rather than an attempt to engage those who write the blog posts to which you attach your comments?
At least, this guy is trying to understand gay people. You would rather shout at any gay person who doesn’t conform to the gay left orthodoxy which you have so slavishly adopted as your own.
Please, don’t feel sorry for me. I don’t need your pity. Your angry disapprobation only serves to strengthen my views — and my resolve to express them.
Sometimes I feel bad about my life and the decisions I’ve made…
…and then I see something like Comment #1.
Hell, I’m not so bad after all, am I ?
No Dave, we’re not.
I love the poster who attacks Evangelicals but supports the party that meets with the guys who shoot gays/intelligent women/jews/whomever they want on soccer fields, if they’re lucky.
Or want to unconditionally meet with the regime who pushes walls on and hangs gays.
But hey, keep on fantasizing you’re bravely standing up against those evil Christians. After all, I plan to pretend to be a Jedi this weekend at our bi-weekly game. Difference is, I know it’s a fantasy.
I agree that conservative gays need to talk to evangelicals. I came out to one of my co-workers who was an evangelical. I could tell he was struggling to talk to me after he ranted about the “homosexeels” (that’s how he pronounced it). He told me it was admirable that I spoke up, but cautioned me I was going against the Bible. He still is nice to me 14 years later. As I said before, it’s easier to catch flies with honey than with vinegar. In other words, we gain more ground talking respectfully to those we disagree with than to scream in their faces. So they disagree with your lifestyle? If your really OK with yourself, their attitudes & beliefs shouldn’t bug you.
“I am glad you get some sort of sense of pride from being partially accepted (because of your far right extremist views) by those who would sooner see you disappear from the face of the earth than really accept you as a valid human being.”
Yeah, imagine those liberals in California in 2000 that loved us so much, that they voted overwhelmingly in an act of Democracy to ban gay marriage (prop. 22). How about thoses ever-loving liberal Oregonians that voted overwhelmingly to ban gay marriage in 2004 (Bush lost in that state). How about those ever-loving presidential candidates that admit to being against gay marriage, the last few you guys have ran, as a matter of fact.
Arizona; McCain’s state, rejected the ban on gay marriage – Bush won there.
What Bush did was something – he gave Americans a voice that they demanded after the Vermont ruling.
What Democrats do is nothing – they use Gays and Blacks as nothing but mere puppets to serve at their electoral pleasure.
What’s the “real America?” San Francisco?
“I could tell he was struggling to talk to me after he ranted about the “homosexeels†(that’s how he pronounced it).”
LMAO Jimbo.
That’s also how Beverly Leslie pronounced it. Right before Karen outted him, remember?
nothing like being a slave to the deluded.
We try not to hold it against you, michael
I’m just savoring the irony that the first comment to a thread about tolerant evangelicals is from a ranting, intolerant liberal.
the ranting intolerant liberals have definately let themselves be heard the past week..
If I was president, i would pass a law so that only people who can pass a mental examination could get on-line.
It is unfortunate that we have lost the ability to talk, to discuss our ideas and our differences. Anymore it just falls out to hate, bitterness, anger, and despair.
I was fortunate, early on in my time, to have a lesbian co-worker who was willing to set aside her anger for a moment, to truly listen to me, to understand me, and help me understand her, who was willing to become my friend, even though we disagreed on some things, important things. She and her partner will always be among my dearest friends, always.
The hate comes from both sides. Neither are right. There are always extremes, but I am glad to find people such as Nick and Jamie who take the time and the courage to step out and trust someone like me.
We all fall short of God’s glory, what he desires for us. Who am I to judge? I disappoint even me. I may disagree with someone’s lifestyle, but that does not change who they are.
None of us are good/righteous, though we strain and yell and protest that we are, and that others are not. Even liberals, such as LGP above, can find God’s redemption (Romans 3). That is more important than anything. And more urgent.
Thanks Dan. Be bold!
Careful Vince,
I deal with Depression and Panic attacks. Online’s pretty damn important to me 😉
Just to follow on what Liberal Gay Patriot said, I DON’T feel sorry for you, Dan, since I know you don’t feel sorry for yourself and have no reason to.
Liberal Gay Patriot, if you ever were to visit my church or otherwise seek out relationships with conservative evangelicals, I think your experience would be a lot different than you think, even if you make your sexual orientation known. Sure, you would meet some Christians who will reject you and say nasty things, and I’m embarrassed that that’s the case. However, I think such people are becoming rarer and rarer all the time. The average person at my church has a fairly complicated view of homosexuality. Each person’s view is a little different, but I think most of the people at my church would have a view that, in general, believes the following:
(1) homosexual acts are one of many sins listed in the Bible
(2) homosexual acts have been unfairly singled out as worse than other common sins
(3a) all people sin, and it’s best to concentrate on one’s own sins rather than those of others (Matthew 7:3-5)
(3b) heterosexual promiscuity, divorce, adultery, and greed are much bigger problems for church members than homosexuality, and preaching in the church should reflect that
(4a) no one is gay by choice, as observed by our own experiences with friends and family members with whom we grew up
(4b) if “nurture” were partly the cause rather than “nature”, it still wouldn’t change the fact that sexual orientation isn’t one’s own choice
(5) ridicule, violence, and threats toward GLBT persons are completely unacceptable sins, and the church needs to repent of these sins inasmuch as they are a part of the past and present church
(6a) GLBT persons often do not fit the stereotypes; it’s best not to make assumptions
(6b) GLBT are no more hyper-sexual than anyone else, nor are they necessarily going to be interested in someone of the same gender; many straight people, both religious and non-religious, have wrongly assumed otherwise and need to be enlightened on this point
(7) one need not tie one’s religious beliefs to matters of public policy; one can believe that gay marriage is wrong as a religious matter, opposing such weddings from occurring at one’s own church, while still believing in government recognition of gay marriages or at least civil unions
(8) these are all complicated matters that Christians should approach with humility, goodwill, and an open mind and should repent of not having such an attitude in the past
That’s as honestly as I can lay it out. Certainly, I don’t speak for all Christians, including those at super conservative churches, but I’ve known many Christians over the years and think I have a pretty good feel for where the average evangelical Christian is these days. Many Christians I know would disagree with me on some of these points, whether from the right or left, but I am quite sure that the vast majority of my Christian friends would agree with these points. I’m also pretty sure that most of the conservative evangelicals Dan has contact with basically believe the points listed above as well.
Yes, it’s complex. Does it amount to gay persons being “partially accepted” by religious conservatives? Well, I dunno, I suppose it sort of does, if one chooses to look at it that way. FWIW, I always try to make no one feel “partially accepted” by me; I always hope to make everyone feel as accepted by me as I possibly can while being true to my beliefs. But no one can wish away the complexities of this issue. Believe me—I wish I could. But all I can really do is try to be as decent as I can to everyone, searching for common ground with those with whom I disagree. If you knew how much my friends and I put our hearts and minds through the wringer on this issue, well, you still might not be completely satisfied, but at least I think you’d look at things differently yourself, realizing it fruitful to seek out conversations with religious conservatives. The thing is, it’s the gay conservatives and gay liberals who open up their lives to religious conservatives who are driving the process of reconciliation. The HRC is not making the public more open to gay marriage. Rather, it’s those members of the GLBT community, some of them conservative but also some of them liberal, who respect the beliefs and traditions of religious and/or traditional straight Americans while looking for opportunities to show how America can be more GLBT-friendly without compromising the traditions that have made America great. Those who assume all religious conservatives are like Jim Dobson or Pat Robertson miss out on great opportunities to build bridges with millions of religious, conservative Americans. I hope you will look for such opportunities, just as Dan and Bruce have.
cme, don’t worry – Happens to the best of us. When it happens to you, your best bet is to send an e-mail to GPW. Assuming he’s online, he’s almost always delighted to fish people’s comments out of the spamfilter.
“The hate comes from both sides. Neither are right.”
Oh really?
I dont go to other sites and say “HEY [you]. I HATE YOU . YOU SUCK”
The thought would never occur to me.
In fact in all my web-travels I dont think i ever see conservatives disrupt anythihng. I’m so sick of this moral equivilence.
No, both sides do not do it. One side has civility and i would dare say rationality and sometimes i wonder what the hell is going on in the deranged mind of someone who can start spouting off just how much i hate myself when he doen’st even know me
Vince, I agree. I don’t frequent liberal sites, trying to spread hate and madness like some lefties try to do here.
so like it was women were treated like dogs, blacks subhuman, and gays sinfully sick,for how many years in american history before the deluded were dismissed????
Vince, context please. Read the second line too. There are extremes on both sides yes. The hate comes from the extremes, not from the rational center. You and I are not in the extremes so we can talk. But we need to truly listen to each other.
The key is to not let the extremes control the conversation. McCain’s response to the protester(s) was great – ignore the ground noise and static. It is the only way we can learn to listen and grow.
yes but, as long as you condone the promulgation of fantasy, like creationism and the sanctiity of human DNA,( which is as common as not), one is not going to make this planet earth a very nice place to live. a hundred of years from now, the planet is bankrupt, if we don’t address it with clarity.
Vince P, I suggest you find some left wing blogs and check out their comment section. Especially the gay one. The attacks on some are brutal, including death threats. You truly need to give up your fantasy of how wonderful the right is and how evil the left is. It’s simply not true You refuse to recognize hate from the right, is that perhaps because you agree with it? And you want to limit access to the internet, how very conservative of you.
#6 Steve, Arizona rejected the marriage ban because it went too far, McCain supported it. Other states that Bush one in passed amendments that outlaw ANY FORM of legal protection for LGBT couples. Must be that right wing love that folks on here claim exists.
I am an Italian American Roman Catholic Gay man…I have spoken to my share of evangelicals and I have said in one simple sentence “God Loves all his Children…Gay and Straight” and that has been met with “yes, you are correct” and “that’s very true”
and that begins and ends the conversation since past that to say you hate Gays is to say you hate God’s children…..and with that there is acceptance and I find that evangelicals look at things a bit different and pause and really think about what I said and it opens up a dialogue then well since that is so, who are we as humans to question God and his judgment…and then it makes it much easier to have a mutual respect, dignity and understanding. Try it and you will see the “light go on” and the kindness one receives in return. I then remind evangelicals that we all should believe in the word of Micah, which is that we all must and each of us must “help the least amongst us, show mercy and justice and walk humbly with thy God” and if we do that then we are all doing God’s work here on Earth.
it is something I try to live by every day and in an Italian American Roman Catholic family trust me, its taken me years to see it as simply as I tried to say it here….but in the end it is true…..and as my father said (who even at age 81 is still very cool about accepting and loving me as his only son who is Gay and far cooler then my sisters, including my NYC liberal sister with her own set of Gay friends) “I want you to be happy and to find love and happiness”
when you say that to evangelicals that love is what its all about and should love each other as God loves us, you can’t lose..and when they tell me that I am a sinner (some still do say that..I remind them we are all sinners and I will pray for them.)
that leaves some of them silent too if after all the other statements don’t achieve a discussion that we are all human and do our best as humans..plus, I do thank them for the prayers and remind them I could use all the prayers I can get….
in the end I find that I may not change someone’s mind but its not my goal…except to maybe get someone to see things in a different light…and if I did..well, cool.and I try to see someone else’s view point…and not see it as I must force someone to accept me…if they have issues, well those are that person’s issues..not mine…after all I have my own…..you don’t grow up in an Italian American Roman Catholic family and not have them…..trust me…and Italian sisters are a tough crowd…..so evangelicals are cream puffs…..sit, chat, have some coffee….smile and hugs (hey I am Italian we love to hug and kiss..its our nature) and you will be surprised that evangelicals are people too…..and a sense of humor helps:)
The issues that the GLBT community cares about will never be won through one party partisan politics. It has been my experience that while a social conservative may strongly disagree with a gay man such as myself, they will, at the very least, typically listen. I cannot in good faith say the same for liberal gay and lesbian folk. In fact, I would go as far to say that I have encountered much more direct and hostile discrimination from liberal GLBT people for my conservative/libertarian views than I have encountered from social conservatives due to my sexuality. Diversity only suits liberal glbt people when others agree with them…which isn’t diversity at all, actually.
#24 Yes dave,
Like that Rigthwing bastion of tolerance in Oregon. Or (sorry Dan!) That state that Bush ‘won’ California will this fall.
Have our normal leftie commenters all become completely unhinged?
Cme, I appreciate the way you have articulated the position of many evangelical Christians, and the respect that you’ve shown on both sides of this issue. I also appreciate the struggle that evangelical Christians have regarding this issue.
What I don’t understand is that in light of reasons 2-8, why is homosexuality still considered a sin? Just as Christians no longer regard eating pork and shellfish a sin, it seems the same can be done with homosexuality.
In the meantime, I’ll take “partial acceptance” vs. outright hate any day.
I don’t know about the hate being equal on both sides. Right-wing sites don’t typically have to turn comments off when a liberal dies. Unlike, say, the Huffington Post.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2008163805_palingays07.html
P.S. There are many “left” blogs with “right” visitors. I found this blog while reading up on the Log Cabin Republican’s ill informed endorsement of Palin/McCain. If the guys who run this sight didn’t want some diversity from time to time they would close the posts to members only. If you wanted a private neocon circle jerk you could have one.
Palin is a bee in my bonnet and until she is dismissed (I still think she will be dropped from the ticket) I feel I have to fight this virus in our political system.
By the way. I used to really like John McCain, back when he really WAS a maverick. When he made decision that he felt were right (correct) for the country not just his party. When he stood up to religious extremists as “agents of intolerance” and when he was a target of Rove’s attacks not a patron of them.
McCain is a POW again. A prisoner of electoral war. I am sure he is now so owned by the neocon elite that he has no choice but to abandon his maverick past and goose step right along party lines. I am sure Palin was NOT his choice but his desire to add this one last feather to his cap has blinded him.
“Vince, context please. Read the second line too. There are extremes on both sides yes. The hate comes from the extremes, not from the rational center. You and I are not in the extremes so we can talk. But we need to truly listen to each other.”
I’m talking about the day-to-day typical environment. i’m talking about what the average temperament and integrity are of the people you are LIKELY to encounter.
Yeah i’m sure there are plenty of evil anarchists on the internet.. but so what , they keep to themselves.. unless Ron Paul is running.
Noone on the Left is calling for their side to calm themselves down .. to stop the hate and lies. YOu see it all the time on the right..
I’ll make a prediction. Go on Free Republic after Ted Kennedy dies and see. You’ll see a few people make comments about how his policies were dangerous to the country and thus they are contemptuous but you’ll see many more offering their regrets and others reminding each other that they are not vicious haters like on the Left and they need to remember that and be respectful
LGP: Maybe you haven’t noticed but Palin’s political motivation is to destroy corruption in the govenment. She not a social conservative crusader.
What is more threatening to your way of life.. the total collapse of the money system and loss of liberty as the Federal Govt has to rule by decree?
She’s VP. Neither McCain or her are going to do anything in the social conservative sphere.
This partisan has to stop or else the country is going to sink under the collosal debt and mismanagement the twoparties created.
Are you an American or not? Or are you just a cock-sucker?
This is the only blog i been where i can talk without getting attacked
http://noquarterusa.net
#24 Dave
The point I was making is that this is more of a “people” issue rather than a political one. Republicans can be blamed of politicizing it ONLY TO the extent of doing what the voters were asking for, which is proved over and over and over again when people vote on it!
Democrats on the other hand use gays (just like the blacks) to soak in victimhood and build upon that in order to get our votes, they then do nothing.
At least Republicans did the right thing by giving voice to the people which was demanded (whether you believe it’s a Constitutional issue or a Democratic one) regardless of how many times they were called homophobic.
While liberals proclaim “personally I don’t agree with gay marriage” they just sit on their hands. At least Bush got it out there and discussed among people.
This is not a party problem. It’s a people problem. How is the gay community perceived as a whole outside the realm of “our world?” How is the community spotlighted? In what ways? Are they portrayed as real people with real problems? Or are they portrayed as novelties to be put away silently when the going gets tough and then taken out when someone needs to be entertained at a suburban dinner party?
Steve Flesher, among the right-wingers and moderates on this forum, we’ve had healthy debates about the pros and cons of same-sex marriage. And there has been a lot of depth, and a lot of reasoning behind both sides’ arguments. When the left “joins the debate,” their basic line of argument seems to be “blah blah blah second class citizen blah blah blah theocrats blah blah blah…”
My mind hasn’t been changed on SSM, if anything I’m a little more against it than I was at the start of the debate here. But it is healthy when people debate from points of reasoning and not just slogans, slurs, and talking points.
I am an All American cock-sucker and I do not see everything as black and white as many on the right seem to do. I also do think that the republican mantra of fiscal conservatism is a LIE and I do believe taxes are a part of being a patriot. When was the last time we were at war and the govt. told us to go shopping and to expect big tax cuts?
Bush has spent us into a massive deficit after an unheard of surplus. Please also look at Palin’s budget for little Wasilla:
http://thinkprogress.org/wonkroom/2008/09/03/wasilla-in-debt/
Looks like a spend and spend and spend republican to me!
Of course conducting a measured turning over of power to the people of Iraq will cost us more money and the next four years will be expensive as we try to rebuild our military and hopefully being rebuilding our crumbling infrastructure (and not building a stupid wall along our southern boarder with money we don’t have).
Think Progress ? Dont think so.
I’m not reading nor thinking about nor spending any more time on things that end up being untrue about the next VP.
I see you’re beyond reason, as all Progresso-marxists are.
If you were objective you would realize you’re in the middle of a deception campaign over there and left of your own accord.
I am willing to bet Wasilla under Palin is a much better place to live than Detroit under Obama’s felonious friend Kwame Kilpatrick, whom Obama described as an “outstanding” mayor.
For that matter, I bet Wasilla is a much better place to live than the south side of Chicago, which seems to have benefited little from the Obamassiah’s mad community organizing skillz, or his work on its behalf in the state legislature (130 times voting “present.”)
ROTFLMAO 🙂 Contrast that with the following, from the same writer:
Palin stood up for gay people when she vetoed a bill that would have denied State employees’ partner benefits. But hey – Let’s not let facts get in the way of deranged, utterly misplaced fury.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. And by the way… I love the smell of left-lib panic in the morning.
Fixed.
I do love the Left’s new mantra of “20 million in long-term debt”. I’d never seen “long-term debt” used in so many conversations before.
Probably because “long-term debt” sounds better than “bonds”.
In other words, liberal hatemongers like LGP are saying that it’s “fiscally irresponsible” for a government entity to issue bonds.
I do believe taxes are a part of being a patriot
Then feel free to raise your own. In fact, why don’t you and your fellow Democrat Party members pledge right here and right now to pay 10% more in taxes next year than you did this year, by yourself, without coercion, out of “patriotism”?
Answer: Because Democrat Party syncophants like you follow the Charlie Rangel rule: taxes are for everyone else.
Heck, members of my church voluntarily tax ourselves an additional 10%. Why shouldn’t believers in the Church of Government do the same?
Huffington Post commenter:
Yeah, these liberal patriots “love” America, it’s Americans they hate.
I’m so tired of their empty promises about moving to Canada or Europe. So many of them said they would leave if Bush won a second term. Could we maybe start a nonprofit for funding their relocation?
V, they love the purple mountains and the (perceived) military and economic power and their sense of being special and enlightened and entitled to a good life. But they don’t want to do anything in the real world that is needed to keep it going, nor support any real-world politicians or policies that keep it going. They just want to preen. Misrepresenting / trashing America is part of the preening.
Steve, I’ve had the same thought. Every person who said in 2004 “I’m moving if Bush is re-elected” should have been held to their freely-given word. In the majority of cases, America would probably be better for it.
#32 – “I am an All American cock-sucker.”
Sounds like something about 99% of the DNC would say.
Wonder if this statement is the culmination of libtard thinking since JFK’s “I am a jelly donut” gaffe.
Jelly donut, cock sucker. Same thing.
Regards,
Peter H.
kinda hard to be real pleased with a country whose leadership violates the constitution and claims that john mccain wasn’t tortured, etc etc.
I guess michael’s post comes from his alternate future, where Obama was elected and we have 57 states.
Only allegations I see of ‘not being tortured’ come from Biden, Fonda and ilk.
“Palin stood up for gay people when she vetoed a bill that would have denied State employees’ partner benefits. But hey – Let’s not let facts get in the way of deranged, utterly misplaced fury.”
Actually no ILC, she vetoed it because it was unconstitutional. But let’s not let facts get in the way blah blah blah
#30 Steve,
” Republicans can be blamed of politicizing it ONLY TO the extent of doing what the voters were asking for,”
Is this in the same alternate reality where you claim they “leave us alone”?
Dave, again, given that gay Democrats like yourself support and endorse FMA supporters, no one is buying your theory that you are against anything of the sort.
In what way have gays not been left alone?
just love the way conservatives try to bury the last eight years of republican corruption and malfeasance as if nothing has happened.
I don’t see anyone doing that Mikey.
Oh wait, you’re talking from the alternate relaity of 57 states and two terms of Obama, aren’t you.
“a task that is from God.”
How much do you have to hate America to be offended when a politician prays for the troops?
Meaning: Contra all the panicked Gay Left hype, Palin certainly does believe gays are fully included in the Constitution, and is willing to go against popular / legislative majorities to carry it out.
Geez, Dave, do I have to spell out everything for you???
“a task that is from God.â€
And Obama claims he is doing “the Lord’s work”, with full endorsement and support from michael.
NDT, that’s a subtle difference that’s lost on michael.
Gov. Palin prays that we are following God’s plan.
Obama claims his plan -is- God’s plan.
One is Hubris, one is arrogence.
Think he can figure it out?
Think he can figure it out?
He can’t even figure out how to use capitals. I wouldn’t trust him to sit on a toilet and face the right way.
#49 NDT, that article has nothing to do with me so your insane attempts to claim you know who I support or what I believe fail miserably yet again. Why do you insist on being stupid?
ILC, you spell nothing out, just your interpretation which has often been ridiculous, but it is yours so feel free.
Well V the K, we’re certainly left alone as long was we don’t ask for anything, behave in the way that Repubs want us too and quietly lurk in the shadows hoping that someday they’ll like us. If we agree with them that the extremes represent all of us and join the chorus of condemnation, that we are bad parents, that we shouldn’t be allowed around children then everything is just nifty to them. In churches as long as we are trying to become “ex-gay” the support and love is overwhelming. But stand up for anything you believe about who you love and all of a sudden you represent the end of civilization, perhaps even the human race, you threaten the “traditional family” and you need to be controlled by laws and amendments and behavior modification through prayer, counseling or violence if necessary. And all this is done with the support of the “gay conservative” who will deny all of it and accuse the “left” of overreacting and trying to force their views on everyone.
So, Dave, in other words, some conservatives have hurt your feelers because they don’t celebrate your lifestyle choices and pray for you to change. Poor baby. I can’t imagine having to cope with the crippling pain of knowing that some people just don’t like me. How do you get out of bed in the morning? Can you? My heart is breaking, Dave. Seriously. Real tears.
I love it when Dave is reduced to his “I put a spell on you!” style of, um, argumentation. It means the other guy won the point. (in this case, me 😉 )
That all depends. On what you are standing up for. I have found Republicans – even evangelical Christians – to be gay-friendly and supportive. They disagree with me about gay marriage, while agreeing with me on many other questions. They have little or no interest in changing me. They often support civil unions. I’m big enough to handle our areas of disagreement.
On the other hand, if I stood up (as I never would) say, for NAMBLA ‘rights’, or bathroom cruising ‘rights’, or sex-in-the-street ‘rights’, or taking-children-to-sex-fairs ‘rights’, as some of the most extreme gays are known to do – then they might disagree with me more loudly. And, they would be right to. So, it all depends on what it is that *I* (the gay person) am pushing or presenting. Am I into good? Or evil?
NDT, that article has nothing to do with me so your insane attempts to claim you know who I support or what I believe fail miserably yet again.
Oh, it has everything to do with you, Dave, because it points out nicely how gay Democrats and HRC drones like yourself support and endorse that which you criticize others for doing.
V the K, I don’t give two shits whether or not conservatives like me but when they attempt to impact my life with laws and lies then it’s on, period. “Lifestyle choices” – figures you’d parrot that nonsense, my lifestyle has nothing to do with my sexual orientation.
ILC, I know that there are some who would consider the things you mention in your second paragraph “rights”, I’m not and never have been one of them. My problem is that a significant number of evangelicals and other conservatives consider the extreme the norm and react to all of us accordingly. I’m happy for you that you have had good experiences, not every has and you have your head in the sand if you can’t acknowledge that their is a strong movement in the evangelical world that totally against us and will not back down from their fight to take back everything we have gained. They can’t win but they can do major damage to people in their crusade.
NDT, you are actually pretty comical. In your arrogance you really believe the things you say about me and what I supposedly support. Well, have at it Bozo, tell me more a good laugh is always pleasant.