“Gays problems everywhere, throughout all time, are not due to anything gays might have done but are entirely due to other people’s homophobia. Anyone who says differently is a bigot or a self-loathing queen.”

Can I have my toaster now?

How is this not being muzzled?

Again, how can you be muzzled if you weren’t planning on speaking in the first place?

“the world,” which is a hyperbole for “general consensus,”

Again: The “consensus” you claim does not exist. And as neither you nor anyone speaks for “the world”, neither you nor anyone would be in a position to positively claim that it does.

But here is the real translation of your comment: Ashpenaz gets to say stupid and offensive things, then later fault people who found his remarks stupid and offensive, because it was so-called “hyperbole”.

The reason we have trouble gaining a voice in groups like CPAC is because when conservatives see us coming, they say, “Oh, no, now we have to fight off the gays–they’re dressed right and they say the right things, but underneath, they’re selling the same old gay agenda. They just want in so they can tear us down, and if we let them speak, that will be just the start.”

Gee, if only I weren’t so self-loathing, I’d see the happy rainbow world people like you see.

I am willing, for the sake of truth, to say “Leftist gays lie in order to infiltrate and undermine.” But what the world thinks is that gays in general lie in order to infiltrate and undermine.

So many things wrong with that, it’s hard to know where to start. I’ll just restrict myself to a couple.
- You don’t know what “the world” thinks. You don’t speak for “the world”. Also, “the world” isn’t a monolith. Groups don’t think; only individuals do.
- In reality, you often do not say “leftist gays”. That’s the point.

As an aside, off the top of my head I can’t think of anything I disagree with LCR on issue-wise (except hate crimes which I’m neutral towards). LCR and GOProud seem to be very similiar to me, though I’m not a member of either so there are probably differences I’m not aware of. Yet given the shenanigans of LCR that were exposed recently and the refusal of top LCR officers to step down, I can understand why GOProud was formed. Skeptical I remain of how effective either will be in the GOP but I do wish them success.

So when Mr. Keene said in an email that marriage would not be debated in the program, it was not a response to or a condition of our sponsorship.

Ok, if you say so Jimmy. Of course according to Mr. Keene “opposition to gay marriage, etc are consensus positions (if not unanimous) among conservatives”. Funny how Mr. Keene was also able to hit all the right buzzwords that make these social con groups weak in the knees like “promoting their lifestyle” and “opposed to the sinner as the sin”. Since “gay issues fall within this category” [issues without merit to debate], what exactly do you hope to accomplish again? How is this not being muzzled? Sorry, I do wish you the best and hope I’m wrong about all of this but I do not find anything about this the least bit encouraging. I guess we’ll just have to wait and see how this plays out.

Comment by Ashpenaz — December 29, 2009 @ 10:56 pm – December 29, 2009

You know, I don’t use the term “self-loathing” hardly at all since liberals use and abuse it so much, but given the bullshit you post here tarring all gays with the same crap that is nothing short of bigotry, I do believe it’s appropriate here.

I am a “social” conservative. But I am also a “fiscal” conservative and a “foreign/national security” conservative. I am a C O N S E R V A T I V E. And I welcome GOPProud being at CPAC and being a part of the conservative/Republican movement. Do I disagree on same-sex marriage? Yes. But, I note that the propriators of this site are in no way knee-jerk about it as would be the LC”R”s.

Now this is a response I can appreciate and respect, disagreements over issues aside.

I sense your feelings are hurt.

Your ways of the Force are flawed, Obi-Wan. It matters not whether the GOP champions SSM, nor am I advocating such. If anything the GOP should remain silent on the matter, as should the DNC, but this is akin to spitting in the wind wishing for either I suppose. Try again.

Do you have any goals that you’d like to accomplish there? What are they? Do they relate to any Gay civil rights bills?

Its your money, but don’t expect enhanced credibility as a Gay organization if you’re just gonna pay for a dance that you aren’t really an equal player at. Or if you’re just there to parrot Conservative talking points while not saying or doing anything on Gay civil rights causes.

I am willing, for the sake of truth, to say “Leftist gays lie in order to infiltrate and undermine.” But what the world thinks is that gays in general lie in order to infiltrate and undermine.

You see, the lying isn’t driven by their sexual orientation, but by their political orientation. This way you [Ash] won’t be offensive by painting all homosexuals with the lying leftist’s brush.

Exactly, CLB.