A delightful irony of the gay “boy” culture
So, an acquaintance of mine, young guy who is attracted to older guys, attracts the (online) attention of a guy at the upper end of his desired demographic. Said older man, born about the time of Dewey’s loss to Truman, uses the term “boy” to describe himself in his online moniker. And no, it’s not some variant of “Boyhunter” or “Boylover.”
Even said acquaintance, born about the time of Reagan’s victory, doesn’t describe himself as “boy,” yet admits being attracted to “daddies.”
So, what does it say about a 60-year-old man interested in 20-something men who calls himself “boy”? (I understand my acquaintance declined the invitation to get acquainted.)
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from what you describe, probably an arrested psycho-sexual development fixated on a younger age.
Hmmm…
wonder if the same applies to so many older straight men looking for girls in their 20′s?
Comment by Liz H — January 23, 2010 @ 5:39 pm - January 23, 2010
It says that men, regardless of their orientation, are all the same. ; )
Comment by WaltzingMtilda — January 23, 2010 @ 5:39 pm - January 23, 2010
I am a homosexual male who will turn 35 in a little more than a month and I despise anyone of legal age who refers to themselves as “boy”, or the much more irritating “boi”. Gay people have an acute dread of aging and any individual whose age starts with a numeral greater than two is an old man, someone to be pitied and shunned, past their prime, and beneath consideration for even the most basic social interaction. I’ve been happily patrnered for a little more than 9 years, and I truly feel bad for single friends and acquaintences of my age group because they struggle so badly to get noticed, let alone get a date. There’s nothing physically wrong with these men, and they have their quirks like anyone else, but once you get to be *that old*, you’re damaged goods, past the expiration date, stale, undesirable. God help the poor gay man over 29. Nobody wants him. Maybe this effect is amplified by the particular semi-isolated gay culture I happen to be part of, but that’s very much the way it works.
As for a 60 (60!) year old man who is delusional enough to describe himself, either by online moniker or bio, as a “boy”, he’s only fooling himself. Hey man, he’s hip, he’s with it. He’s got the energy to run with the younger crowd. He’s up on all the latest cool gay culture and the lexicon. He can wear tight clothes and shave his body and look just as good as any 20 year-old. He’s one of you youngin’s, right? He fits in with your crowd, it’s ok to accept him, maybe even be attracted to him. I mean, he’s not old and used up like you think he is. Oh no, he’s super cool and super hot and you should engage in oral sex with him RIGHT NOW!
Ugh, speare me. Guys like this are what gives “older” gay men such a bad name. It’s a spiral: The 60 year-old man acts like a child, which turns off the younger men he’s interested in because of age dysmorphia, which causes the 60 year-old to double down, which causes him to be avoided and disliked even more. Meanwhile the stigma of the “old gay man” spills over onto those of us who don’t behave that way, and who aren’t “old”.
Guess what, gay men: you are what you are. The sooner you accept it, the happier we’ll all be. You’re 60? Yeah, you may not be the physical specimen you were, but that doesn’t make you worthless or unwanted. Pretending to be 20 is what makes you an ass nobody wants to be around. Act your age, make some friends you have genuine commonalities with, and enjoy your life.
Whatever happened to children who wanted to grow into adults? Why do we have adults who persist in seeing themselves and portraying themselves as children? I’m happy to have (almost) lived to the ripe old age of 35 and if someone were to describe me as a boy, I’d take offense. If I were to describe myself as a boy, I’d feel embarrassed by my own stupidity. My maturity has provided me with a perspective and a sense of self that very, very few men 15 years younger than me can have. And I like it.
Those are the somewhat disjointed thoughts of one gay *man* who is frequently annoyed by exactly what’s described in your post.
Comment by Aaron — January 23, 2010 @ 7:04 pm - January 23, 2010
Ick.
Comment by Charles — January 23, 2010 @ 7:15 pm - January 23, 2010
No, men aren’t all the same. Gay men who support 60-year old men going out with 20-year olds are sick. Some forms of homosexuality are sinful. The inability of the gay community to name sickness and sin when it is obvious is one of the main reasons people don’t vote for gay marriage or adoption. Many gays apparently want to combine marriage and adoption.
If this kind of behavior really is OK, why don’t we make a commercial with a loving 60-year old and his 20-year old partner? If we all think this is fine, why don’t we advertise it and see how many votes we win? Why cover it up?
“But straights do it too! Waaah!” The next several posts will say that because straights do it, it must be OK. Maybe we shouldn’t turn to heterosexual men for our examples. Maybe we should turn to God and see what He wants us to do.
Comment by Ashpenaz — January 23, 2010 @ 7:18 pm - January 23, 2010
It says he wants to get away with acting like a 20-year old.
It could be arrested development, or it could be willful regression. Some adults live very responsible lives, then in their 50s or 60s get divorced and try for a last fling at being a wild 20-something; that would be willful regression. Others never progress to the point of living responsible lives in the first place; that would be arrested development.
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — January 23, 2010 @ 7:28 pm - January 23, 2010
Humm. I spent thirty years in a relationship with a man who was ten years older than me, but I would never consider a 40 year difference. I’m 58, quite happy with my life and couldn’t even consider sex with anyone that young. . I would be embarrassed to let a young man of 20 see me without clothes. Damn, I don’t even like my doctor seeing me without clothes. I deliberately live in a suburban area, I have no interest in sitting in some bar in SF drinking myself to death. (Think Twin Peaks). Yes, there are young guys who fixate on much older men, and vis versa, but this old man wants nothing to do with it.
Comment by John in Dublin CA — January 23, 2010 @ 7:52 pm - January 23, 2010
I pointed out once to a 18 year old (I was 35 at the time) that I was graduating about the time she was born.
As to men being attracted to younger women Liz? “You’re only as young as the woman you feel.”
Seriously though, while I might enjoy looking at 20 somethings, I’m old enough that I need someone with life under their belt.
Comment by The_Livewire — January 23, 2010 @ 8:03 pm - January 23, 2010
Sigh, the only (younger) guys that cross my 50-yo path in gay venues seem to be more interested in the contents of my wallet than of the contents of my character…God-fortend, my body.
**sigh**
Not that I want to date a twink…but there are plenty of cute, hot and intelligent 30-45 guys I cross paths with that I’d like to get to know, But they all want to be 20-again and be one-of-the twinks. I think physiologically I’m still in the thirties; so I guess I can’t blame them, but…..
**sigh**
Comment by Ted B. (Charging Rhino) — January 23, 2010 @ 8:09 pm - January 23, 2010
We need to bring back the old jokes about the “Old Goat” and the “Spring Chicken.”
Homo or hetro. It’s just laughably pathetic.
Best wishes,
-MFS
Comment by MFS — January 23, 2010 @ 8:32 pm - January 23, 2010
When I was 25, I had an 18 y/o that I dated and moved in with me. Even at that young age, I found his immaturity annoying, but I overlooked it. After two weeks of living with me, he decided that my house rules were “too tyranical” and he split.
Comment by ThatGayConservative — January 23, 2010 @ 9:44 pm - January 23, 2010
Can you help me out, here Ash? I’ve checked my Bible and concordance and have no idea what you’re talking about.
Comment by ThatGayConservative — January 23, 2010 @ 9:46 pm - January 23, 2010
If I’m in my 40s and dating someone close to my own age, is it OK with all of you if I introduce him as my boyfriend? Or would you prefer that I call him my manfriend?
At what age do the members of the “Old Boy Network” cease being members?
Down South, you’re a “good old boy” until what age? What are you called when you reach that age? A “good old man”?
Are men in their 20s still boys? Or do they cease to be boys at 21? At 18?
Comment by Conservative Guy — January 23, 2010 @ 10:25 pm - January 23, 2010
It’s either profound denial, lack of self awareness, or he’s someone who came out late in life and thinks that’s how all gay men refer to themselves or he’s so happy about finally being out it makes him feel positively boyish.
Comment by KevinQC — January 23, 2010 @ 11:18 pm - January 23, 2010
And to answer comment #13, “boy” in those examples doesn’t have the same connotation at ALL that it has in the gay slang lexicon.
Comment by KevinQC — January 23, 2010 @ 11:21 pm - January 23, 2010
Haha John, the local bar not the show. As a fellow local, you know that we also call it _The Glass Coffin_.
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — January 24, 2010 @ 1:26 am - January 24, 2010
Houston has a fundraising social organization called the Bayou City “Boys” Club…..has nothing to do with boys…..mostly “business men” that raise a lot of money for the gay community service organization.
Personally I have never liked the name of the organization….sounds like a chapter of NAMBLA….I seem to be the only one that doesn’t think that “boys” is silly.
Comment by JebnTex — January 24, 2010 @ 9:22 am - January 24, 2010
Maybe the ‘Gentleman’ created the profile in his teens and never bothered to change the name.
oh..wait, Al Gore didn’t invent the internet until 1991.
Comment by JohnJohn — January 24, 2010 @ 10:21 am - January 24, 2010
“But straights do it too! Waaah!”
And it’s still creepy when straights do it. Hereabouts, there’s a seventy-something guy who just married a 20-something Filipina chick, and it creeps me (and a lot of other people) the frakk out.
On the other hand, he’s not walking around with a backwards baseball cap calling himself “boy.”
Comment by V the K — January 24, 2010 @ 12:22 pm - January 24, 2010
I’m 23 and I wouldn’t use boy in any online name I would make…cause I’m now over 18.
Comment by Darkeyedresolve — January 24, 2010 @ 1:34 pm - January 24, 2010
If he’s got money and/or life insurance, he’s toast before long.
Comment by ThatGayConservative — January 24, 2010 @ 2:01 pm - January 24, 2010
Sin is when you have sex with someone God doesn’t want you to have sex with.
Here’s a handy way to find out: before you have sex with a person, ask God, “Hey, God, do you want me to have sex with this person?” You will hear a wee, tiny voice in your heart of hearts–this is called your “conscience”–where you will get a strong sense whether what you’re about to do is right or wrong.
You can help make this wee, tiny voice get stronger by going to church, praying, taking the sacraments, reading Scripture, etc. The more you practice listening for the wee, tiny voice of conscience, the better you will be at it. And it will prevent you from having sex with people God doesn’t want you to have sex with–even better than PFLAG!
I think it would be interesting if the gay community starting working on rediscovering the concept of having a conscience.
Here’s a hint: If you are 60 years old and you are wondering whether or not to have sex with a 20 year old, God says No.
Comment by Ashpenaz — January 24, 2010 @ 4:25 pm - January 24, 2010
I also know a 38 year old guy whose preferred prey is adolescent African-Americans. He says their mommas aren’t creeped out by it because they like the idea of an older white guy with a job taking care of their sons.
Comment by V the K — January 24, 2010 @ 5:00 pm - January 24, 2010
I have a theory about guys like that who pursue significantly younger men. I believe that a lot of these men came out later in life, when it was too late to enjoy the sexual energy of their youth. Maybe because given when they were born, it was much more difficult to come out and find acceptance. Hence they try to recapture that lost time by pursuing men WAY younger themselves. Seems like these guys always claim they have more in common with men significantly younger, but the only thing they really have in common is the desire to have sex with men of that younger age.
I’m not saying it applies to all of them and I’m definitely not endorsing or approving such behavior. It’s just a working theory I have.
Comment by Neptune — January 24, 2010 @ 5:19 pm - January 24, 2010
I’m 26 and I’ve never been attracted to anyone who referred to themselves as “boy”… but less the magnitudes more annoying “boi”. I find that people are usually only about 75% as mature as they imagine themselves to be, so anyone imagining themselves as a “boy” is in pretty bad shape.
Comment by DoDoGuRu — January 24, 2010 @ 7:30 pm - January 24, 2010
I’m amazed by gay men in their 30s and 40s (or older) who write personal ads looking for someone from 18 to whatever upper age limit they set. Eighteen! Do they ask the boy if he needs any help with his homework for high school? If he has a date for the prom? Do they try to bring the boy into bars? Do they take the boy out to dinner and try to order a glass of wine for him? What are they thinking?
Comment by Conservative Guy — January 24, 2010 @ 9:31 pm - January 24, 2010
Neptune, I have a simpler theory: Younger *men* are hotter. Not more interesting as people, but more physically healthful and removed from Death, and in consequence of that, more aesthetically pleasing – for older people, people who are closer to Death. It’s simply the truth. Older guys (like myself, mid-40s) can often say “I don’t date much younger men; they are immature and so too dull.” But never do you hear “The tightness of a 21-year old’s body is aesthetically repellant.” Never.
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — January 24, 2010 @ 9:38 pm - January 24, 2010
#13 In the South, a good old boy is one to death. Moving here from the North East when I escape from the liberal hell I attended in Conn, my wife was surprised to hear 60 year old women talk about going out with girls. So until I read the comments, I’d have wondered if he was just southern.
Comment by Kevin — January 25, 2010 @ 12:01 am - January 25, 2010
OK, I’ll say it–I find the tightness of a 21-year-old’s body aesthetically repellent. Ick. There’s no hair. There’s no development. It’s all so smooth and feminine. I like mature, muscular bodies like Jason Statham or Dominic Purcell or Brent Favre.
I think that as you grow up sexually, you start wanting to have sex with people who are just as close to Death as you are.
Comment by Ashpenaz — January 25, 2010 @ 8:19 am - January 25, 2010
I’m a 47 year old escort in Los Angeles, and am happy to report that plenty of men aren’t interested in boi’s. Thank God! As far as all the analysis of the sick gay culture, though, let’s not get carried away. The tradition of men going after the nubile young thing is not confined to us, and is probably even represented on some early cave paintings.
PS – I love this blog.
Comment by Eric Whitney — January 25, 2010 @ 1:20 pm - January 25, 2010
Maybe it is a southern thing. Our housekeeper who has worked for us for over 20 years refers to us as her boys. And we’re 49 and 52!
Comment by David in N.O. — January 25, 2010 @ 4:43 pm - January 25, 2010
At 21? I think you’re talking about 12.
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — January 25, 2010 @ 5:56 pm - January 25, 2010
(and I would agree with your sentiments there)
Comment by ILoveCapitalism — January 25, 2010 @ 5:57 pm - January 25, 2010
Yes, there is some hair. But at 18, the body just isn’t fully developed and it is still smooth and feminine in a way that I think is icky. 30 is my lower limit.
Although, the set of men I find attractive and the set of men who find me attractive doesn’t seem to intersect at any point.
Comment by Ashpenaz — January 25, 2010 @ 6:17 pm - January 25, 2010
As I inch closer to 30, I find, oddly, younger and younger guys hitting on me. And I don’t look that young. My partner has grey hairs, etc. and he has noticed it too. Not a few years younger, but much younger. Like 21, 22. Cute guys, too. I think it is kind of bizarre, but frankly, I find these …um… children… to be horribly dull, brainless but pretty things.
Comment by Blake Flint — January 26, 2010 @ 11:52 am - January 26, 2010
“from what you describe, probably an arrested psycho-sexual development fixated on a younger age.
Hmmm…
wonder if the same applies to so many older straight men looking for girls in their 20’s?”
Patently false statement, it’s usually LGBT men that look for younger women. however, I will acknowledge that it is fun for no strings attached relations with LGBT young women.
Comment by RJLigier — January 26, 2010 @ 2:20 pm - January 26, 2010
What an unmitigated joy to read the majority of you spewing the judgmental crap you generally despise. Human relationships run the gamut; who are you to judge when one man is too old for another man? In this blog, you have referred to or implied that young gay men are “twinks,” “underdeveloped and feminine,” “insipid,” “gold-digging” and the list goes on. You’ve described relationships between older and younger men as “ick,” “sick,” “sinful,” “arrested development,” “laughably pathetic,” and more, and have suggested that young men can’t have “a sense of self.”
We’re supposed to be conservatives who judge people on individual merit. I am 45 years old, and my partner of five years is 17 years my junior. He is the antithesis of twink. He’s certainly not underdeveloped and feminie. As the valedictorian of Louisiana State University who currently is pursuing a doctorate while holding down a professional job, he certainly is not insipid. And finally, he is fiercely financially independent.
I did not rob the cradle; he robbed the rocking chair. But that’s not important. What’s important is it’s not for you for for I to judge the validity of others’ relationships. This is the very thing gay men have decried for years, and here you are doing it to yourselves.
That? Sucks.
That is all
Comment by Scott V. — February 2, 2010 @ 3:48 pm - February 2, 2010