Want to know what we as Americans are facing in our near future? All you need to do is follow the news out of Greece.
ATHENS, Greece (AP) – Rioting over harsh austerity measures left three people dead in a torched Athens bank and clouds of tear gas drifting past parliament, in an outburst of anger that underlined the long and difficult struggle Greece faces to stick with painful cutbacks that come with an international bailout.
The deaths were the first during a protest in Greece in nearly 20 years.
Fear that the bailout won’t stop the debt crisis from spreading to other financially troubled EU countries like Portugal and Spain intensified amid the violence Wednesday, as credit ratings agency Moody’s put Portugal on watch for a possible downgrade.
The euro sank, dipping below $1.29 for the first time in over a year, on fears of crisis contagion and concerns that political upheaval might keep Greece from keeping its end of the bailout bargain.
Greece faces a May 19 due date on debt it says it can’t repay without the help. The new government cutbacks, which slash salaries and pensions for civil servants and hike consumer taxes, are being imposed as condition of getting a euro110 billion ($142.16 billion) package of rescue loans from the International Monetary Fund and the other 15 European Union countries that use the euro as their currency.
Many Greeks realize some cutbacks are necessary to pull their country, which has a massive debt of euro300 billion ($387.72 billion), back from the brink of default, and reaction until now had been relatively muted by Greece’s volatile standards. But with people beginning to feel the pain of austerity measures, anger boiled over.
Greece and the entire EU are at a dangerous tipping point and I sincerely believe the bottom is about to drop out of the world economy in a way that will make 2008 look like an economic boom. Mark my words.
The United States Government has enabled the public sector to the point that its salaries and benefits dwarf the private sector. That is dangerous. Our peaceful and classy public sector unions, like SEIU, will take to the streets in a heartbeat if a dime is dared to be taken from them.
Mark my words. My friends, we are witnessing The Fourth Turning.
-Bruce (GayPatriot)
Maggie Thatcher… The problem with Socialism is that you eventually run out of other people’s money.
I want all of the liberals and “progressives” here who state that massive tax burdens, nationalization of industries, regulation of everything, all-powerful unions, universal health care, and cradle-to-grave socialism create prosperity and wealth to explain one thing.
(pointing at Greece) That.
I am saddened by the deaths, and will be more saddened if there are more to come. Nonetheless, I salute the rioters, for reasons now to explain.
Greece got into its mess by over-spending, over-taxing (so that rich Greeks want to send their capital abroad – and are morally right to do so), over-growing the public sector, financial cheating – you know, the hallmarks of a socialist culture. The worst thing that could happen, for them and for the world, is for them to be bailed out. Bailing them out only postpones the inevitable, and meanwhile rewards the worst people and worst behavior. You know… like Obama and Bernanke have done with GM and the top Wall Street banks.
The best thing the EU could do is let Greece fail. Contrary to popular wisdom, that would actually strengthen the Euro by protecting its value or “hardness”, which in turn would preserve living standards in the remaining Euro zone and let there be at least one good currency in the world (other than gold). It would also strengthen Greece in the long run, by making Greece face up to its problems, like when you cut off an addict and kick him out of the house.
An EU /
U.S.IMF bailout of Greece has been announced, but is on shaky ground and could still be aborted. To the extent that the Greek rioters make the world feel like there is no hope for Greece, like the bailout shouldn’t happen because it would only be pouring good money into the bottomless maw of a now-worthless nation – the rioters create some chance of the bailout still being aborted. Which would be a good thing.Big Government / socialism/ fascism can “work, sort of” if you have a homogenous culture that acquires and preserves a strong work ethic, AND a relatively hard currency to keep people financially disciplined, AND if you keep really quite a large zone in your economy for capitalism, AND if you are also blessed with a “sugar daddy” either like a wealthy patron country or a lucky resource that other countries happen to really, really want to trade you for. Israel and Norway prove it.
BUT. You need all those things I just listed. And socialism inherently undermines them, over time. And Greece now has none of them.
You guys are being ridiculous. There is no comparison between Greece and the USA. The Greek problem was caused by massive irresponsible government spending that led to huge deficits and an explosion of national debt. Greek politicians were paralyzed from doing anything about it because they feared retaliation from the powerful public employee unions. Furthermore, Greek politicians systematically lied about how bad the problem was.
See, it’s nothing like the USA at all.
It is interesting to see what is happening Globally, this would actually be good news for the US. The dollar is gaining strength due to belief about the European Debt problems, with Spain, Ireland and Portugal but also a slow down in China. We should be able to take advantage since we seem to be actually doing rather well comparatively speaking, but we need to handle the debt problem before it becomes out of hand.
DER, you have said something I agree with 100%. Unfortunately, what are the chances of our getting a handle on debt? Tax increases won’t do it: we are on the ‘wrong’ part of the Laffer curve, the part where increases only make the economy worse. It has to be done through massive spending cuts and and reversal of the massive recent increases in the size of government. But look who’s in charge of the U.S. right now. Fat chance.
So the dollar’s rise against the Euro will be temporary. The trick is in guessing what “temporary” means – i.e. how much, how long, how best to exploit the opportunity. I’m watching the dollar index, looking for the right moment to further allocate to Eurozone stocks. Already the dollar has *not* been rising in value against gold or against most emerging-market currencies. Good thing I’ve already allocated decently to those.
Think your IRA and 401k is safe?
“…The radical solution most favored by Big Labor is the seizure of private 401(k) plans for government disbursement — which lets them off the hook for their collapsing retirement scheme. And, of course, the Obama administration is eager to accommodate their buddies.”….
http://gatewaypundit.firstthings.com/2010/05/obama-administration-makes-plans-to-gobble-up-401ks/
“… Democrats in the U.S. House have been conducting hearings on proposals to confiscate workers’ personal retirement accounts including 401(k)s and IRAs and convert them to accounts managed by the Social Security Administration.
http://www.carolinajournal.com/exclusives/dems-target-private-retirement-accounts.html
You really think the government won’t just dip into that pot of money…just like they’ve done for decades to Social Security. And co-mingling private funds and the under-funded union pension funds would eliminate any transparency or accountability…just like Social Security. And everyone will get the same payout, regardless of how much you had saved of your own money, and it wouldn’t be inheritable.
think that can’t happen? Argentina confiscated ALL private pensions and used the money to pay-off on it’s foreign debt.
Is Greece our future, or Argentina?
The Obama administration and the Democrats have quietly been talking about confiscating all privately-funded pensions, IRA’s, and 401k’s to fund the underfunded Big Labor and public-sector union pensions. And like in Argentina set-up an unfunded annuity-program that would pay all retirees equally irrespective of their incomes or how much they had already saved….oh, just like Social Security.
Better yet, they could dip into the “surplus”…just like with the Social Security “Trust Fund”…to paydown the deficit and dole-out more pork. Think that wouldn’t happen, Argentina used their middle-class’ hard-earned retirement savings to pay-off Argentina’s foreign-currency debt leaving the annuity-fund bankrupt.
Don’t believe me, just Google “obama confiscate 401k”
Sadly, there are too many gay lefties who are okay with having their retirement savings confiscated in exchange for a House Speaker who will issue a declaration recognizing LGBTQF History month.
um… both?
#10: “Sadly, there are too many gay lefties who are okay with having their retirement savings confiscated in exchange for a House Speaker who will issue a declaration recognizing LGBTQF History month.”
Oh, that’s just illogical crazee talk, V the K. Don’t you get it? The willingness of a politician to support a resolution that acknowledges the wonderful contributions that gays and lesbians have made to our society INDISPUTABLY PROVES that they are people of uncompromised virtue with only the highest ethical standards. Thus, people who recognize LGBTQF History Month are incapable of doing anything like what you’ve described. It simply can’t happen.
To reiterate, liberals are virtuous, kind, and ethical. So, they can’t do anything unethical or mean. But even if I were to accept your ridiculous hypothetical for the sake of argument, if a Democrat in some through-the-looking-glass fourth dimention did something like confiscate pension funds and use the money to fund the vital government programs and compassionate agencies that Americans depend on, it would only be because they were forced to by the evil Republicans that destroyed the US economy. You see, Republicans lie, steal, and kill for fun. It’s what they do. You can hardly blame Democrats for making the difficult decisions needed to clean up the GOP’s mess.
See how that works?
Speak o’th’ devil. Gold up $35 today despite the dollar also rising. Stocks plunge. Supposedly, all on new riots in Greece. But I’m seeing other articles which suggest the stock plunge was actually a big hedge fund liquidating. The media’s reasons for why markets do this on any given day, are usually wrong.
Republicans CHEAT Sean. You forgot one.
#14: YES! Thank you, Delusional Bill, they DO cheat! Because they are cheaters! That’s what they are. And you know what else? I heard that they kill kittens for FUN! Can you believe there are people who vote for these monsters that kill kittens? What is happening in the world?! What about the kittens?! Why does President Obama allow these people to bring their racist signs to DC and incite violence and provoke the murder of kittens?! President Obama needs to throw all of them in jail before they kill him just like they killed all of those defenseless kittens.
I’m NOT saying they don’t have the right to free speech. Progressives are the only ones that believe in free speech. It’s the GOP that shuts down free speech and throws people in jail for protesting Bushco’s War for Oil. No one is saying that they don’t have free speech! All I’m saying is that free speech has to be responsible and not hateful. If the teabaggers were responsible and didn’t threaten the President’s life, and shout “nigger” at all the black people in Congress, and act all racist by saying that Obama is Hitler and a communist, then I would have no problem with them. But they are preaching hate and violence and that is NOT protected speech. So, the First Amendment doesn’t even apply you ignorant redneck. Why don’t you try opening a book for once.
(By the way, this is the current draft of a monologue I’m working on. My character is a young, hip, intelligent, featured blogger at the Huffington Post. I think it still needs a little work because to me it reads a bit too logical for a HuffPost blogger. I’m going to add a reference to Haliburton and the fact that the GOP wants to exterminate the gays and then see if it sounds a little more authentic.)
Sean we will now question ANY semblance of rationality as you admit you actually read the HuffPuff.
#16: Delusional Bill, I assure you. I visit the HuffPuff just to marvel at the unmitigated lunacy and to post a few choice comments to watch some leftist heads explode. I mean, it’s not like I would ever go to the local zoo and poke sharp sticks at some endangered tigers. (I love animals and would never mistreat them.) But if rattling the cages of the wildebeasts over at HuffPuff is wrong, I don’t want to be right.
But if rattling the cages of the wildebeasts over at HuffPuff is wrong, I don’t want to be right.
Comment by Sean A — May 7, 2010 @ 7:27 am – May 7, 2010
Wildebeasts? Wouldn’t rabid shrews be more in keeping with the theme over there?
#18: I used “wildebeasts” as a shorthand reference to HuffPuff’s readers, but you’re right. That label is criminally inadequate to accurately describe them. In the future, I’ll just refer to the group and their mission by their full names: Beelzebub’s cannibalistic army of baby-slaughtering chupacabras and their unspeakable, dark crusade to destroy all that is good and holy in the world. (Alternatively, I sometimes call them “Arianna’s Armada of Flying Monkeys,” but I have to be in a REALLY good mood.)