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Truce in the Culture Wars?

by

Michael Barone has a great piece in the Washington Examiner where he takes note of a phenomenon most welcome to Reagan Republicans like myself, the emergence of a “truce in [the] culture wars” as voters become increasingly concerned about the sour economy and the bloated federal government:

The fact is that there is an ongoing truce on the social issues, because for most Americans they have been overshadowed by concerns raised by the weak economy and the Obama Democrats’ vast increase in the size and scope of government.

And with this truce, comes increasing acceptance of gay people.

There’s a sharp difference between old and young voters on same-sex marriage, and my guess is that young voters will continue to favor it by wide margins as they grow older; but maybe not. In the meantime, discrimination against or disparagement of gays and lesbians is increasingly frowned on by larger and larger majorities.

Indeed, many conservatives frown against such disparagement, with some opponents of state-recognized same-sex marriage treating gay individuals with dignity and favoring civil unions.

It’s Barone.  Read the whole thing.

Comments

  1. Hi Dan, this is a great article. And I agree, I think that civil unions are a humane alternative. I think most of the big blunders of the last ten years ( http://tinyurl.com/23kcfob ) had to do with money and war, not cultural values. So it will be healthy for us to move forward, and it seems partisanship can decline if we focus on common ground. My only worry about “gay” issues is that gay activists on both sides of the aisle might think the repeal of DADT was a done deal and now it’s time to move on to other issues. Now isn’t the time to get bored with gay military issues, because there are thousands of gay servicemembers who still have to deal with unofficial discrimination. And the progress Barone is talking about might be identifiable among attitudes in the Navy or Air Force, but in the Army and Marines there is still a very entrenched antigay culture that runs all the way to the top. For their sake I hope people stay abreast of the repeal implementation and hold military leaders accountable for changing the actual social conditions for gays in the service, since DADT was, truth be told, the least of their worries.

  2. “The fact is that there is an ongoing truce on the social issues, because for most Americans they have been overshadowed by concerns raised by the weak economy and the Obama Democrats’ vast increase in the size and scope of government.”

    The fact is if the Republicans want core Tea Party support they’re just going to HAVE to ease up on the social issues, at least insofar as trying to pass laws is concerned. I’ve heard the opposite from some of the more hardcore, that we will be the ones out in the cold if we lose their social conservative support, but…no. Not this time. If they’re gonna dig their heels in anywhere it’ll probably have to be abortion (and frankly that isn’t going to go anywhere either but that’s above my pay grade, so) but the rest is going to have to take a real backseat. Like you said, I’m sure there’s MORE than enough to keep ’em really busy for a few cycles before they can even get to that stuff anyway. I mean come on; we’re as close to all-out socialism as we can possibly get without turning from the Roman Republic into the Roman Empire; so how’s about focusing on the economy and enormous government overreach, real cuts, real constitutional issues and let the rest wait until we’re all in a bit of a better financial condition to worry about it. By then…it won’t be such a huge problem anymore 😉

  4. This just goes to show why the Huckabees and Bauers have proven as much enemies to conservatism and to the stability of taxpayers as the Obama crew. In fact, some of these characters use their “traditional values” to mask the fact that they are fiscal RINOs who will cut deals with the Democrats as needed to advance themselves politically.

    I agree it is important to fight against authoritarian political correctness and I’m willing to rationally discuss ways to accomodate those of faith and those who want to make sure same sex couples and their families are treated fairly and those who are combination of both.

    It is counter-productive for those working for change in the way taxpayers are treated to waste time condemning some of their fellow travelers to damnation and knowingly trying to antagonize them. There ARE INDEED more pressing matters to attend to as this administration is amply proving.

    And the more I talk with my fellow so-called GLBTs, even I’m surprised by how many share much of my views on fiscal matters and this administration. Those so-called hard core members of the right are just going to have to accept and live with that fact and benefit from the contributions we can make to Tea Party and reform efforts.

  5. But there is a storm a brewin’ over CPAC 2011 . . . Some of the folk have their hands on their hips over Goproud being a sponsor and are already packing up their toys and going to a different sandbox.

    The bigger the fit, the better.

  6. 4: As opposed to forcing your values or those of whichever rigthwing pressure group is screaming “family values! family values!” this week? Sorry, but as long as we are forcing people to pay for the education of others at government-run institutions, those forking over the dough have every right to try and influence the curiculuum as they see fit. It appears that all you are asking for is the ‘right’ to take someone else’s money and demand their silence on how it is spent. That’s not how we do things in this country, or rather that’s not how we’re supposed to be doing things. You will not see a “truce” on this until that factor goes away. Nationwide school choice whether a voucher or a tax credit would seem to me to resolve this nicely.

  7. “If they’re gonna dig their heels in anywhere it’ll probably have to be abortion (and frankly that isn’t going to go anywhere either…)”

    It doesn’t matter anymore where soc-cons dig in their heels. The rest of the country is sick of them and no longer cares. They will play ball with the Tea Party because that’s where the power is, and they’ll accomplish nothing meaningful without them.

    Abortion, however, IS going somewhere. It’s going away (abortion on demand, anyway). It’s going down. Polls show the younger generation — the same one that so largely accepts gays — actually opposes abortion far more vehemently than their parents do. So it’s toast.

    The 21st Century is going to give an ass-whupping to a whole lot of folks who thought they owned the world. And that includes BOTH bullies who want to legislate their own, peculiar theology and frustrated old broads who hate men and children and want the right to abort the latter to keep from making more of the former.

    It’s a brave new world, and nobody owns it.

  9. I’m fascinated by the notion that an all encompassing government is not seen by every Civil Right loving citizen as a bigger personal threat than whether or not this or that ‘wedge’ issue is at the forefront of today’s political discussion. Unless and until government grows smaller and the inherent rights to decide where my property is or is not allocated is strengthened my being gay isn’t even on the radar screen.

  10. DB, some people would argue that if human life can be extinguished in the womb by those more powerful than the little souls whose lives are being snuffed out, other rights mean very much. If we can’t even secure human life, then no other property rights matter much.

    I’m fascinated by the notion that the very right to survive the womb can be considered a “wedge” issue.

    If it is, then all other human life is up for grabs if the majority of American Idol-numbed zombies vote to forget about it. Then the gays can stand in line for that noose, because it’ll be here sooner than we can imagine.

  12. The social conservatives have to do the calculus of governing by accepting a truce with the Tea Party and the fiscally-conservative…or being obstructionists while in perpetual opposition as their support from younger voters and minorities in the center slips away.

  13. Would this truce include the left no longer using the public schools to indoctrinate children in their secular values?

    V… I don’t know… Given the school’s track record…. Do you really want the schools to teach anything about values??? 🙂

    Define what the values are that you’re concerned schools teach. They do teach things such as:

    * Don’t steal.

    * Be kind to your neighbors.

    * Be honest.

    What do you want them to teach / not to teach. This would make a good blog post in and of itself.

  14. Here Here to Barone. I did not join the Tea Party movement because I saw too many signs that it was co-opted by the stronger social conservative faction. I hope this next congressional session will prove me wrong. We’ll have to wait and see.

  15. Good article by Mr. Barone. We have bigger fish to fry (like fighting creeping reaches of socialism). As far as the hissy fit, foot-stomping snit exhibited by the soc-cons about gay participation in the upcoming conservative conference: there’s the door; don’t let it smack you in the ass on the way out. Honestly, these people remind me of little kids who holds their breath because they’re not getting their way. Let the gay community be the adults in the room.

  16. Do you really want the schools to teach anything about values?

    The only values I want the schools to teach are “Work hard and you’ll be rewarded with good grades,” “Cheat and you get expelled” and “Behave like a thug and you get expelled.” Everything else ought to be left to parents, churches, and communities. Schools should focus on practical skills and real knowledge.

    Unfortunately, many teachers regard teaching facts and practical skills as “boring.” Teaching social propaganda is more interesting.

  17. Abortion, however, IS going somewhere. It’s going away (abortion on demand, anyway). It’s going down. Polls show the younger generation — the same one that so largely accepts gays — actually opposes abortion far more vehemently than their parents do. So it’s toast.

    I seriously hope so. No matter what anyone may think of abortion it’s always bugged me that it was supposedly so ‘sacrosanct’ that no restrictions or regulation of it at all could be permitted. When you add to this that some courts even demanded that taxpayers pay for abortions in certain circumstances and that just ticked me off. Mind you, all of this is even before you bring in the morality of abortion which for the record I oppose.

  18. Unfortunately, many teachers regard teaching facts and practical skills as “boring.” Teaching social propaganda is more interesting.

    There are quite a number of bad teachers, but not as many as you may think. Don’t forget that the curiculuum is set by the school board and the state, not the individual teacher. There are quite a few that would love to actually teach but are being hampered by those above them, as well as parents who think sending their kids to public school means they don’t have to do anything themselves to help their lil’ darlings.

  19. 15: Agreed. Heck, I have family involved with the TEA Party movement and while I trust them I do not trust anyone else. I too have a “wait and see” attitude on them. I’m not convinced that the majority aren’t just social cons in faux libertarian clothing.

  20. This post just proves I was right when I said that (most) gay “conservatives” are social liberals infiltrating the conservative movement in order to make the social Left’s agenda integral to conservatism and silence social conservatives. There is real hatred and contempt for social conservatives here, the kind you’d expect to find on the Daily Kos or the Huffington Post. On this there really is no difference between the gay Left and the gay “Right”.

    A truce in the culture war? Orwellian rubbish! A truce means all sides in a conflict lay down their weapons and STOP FIGHTING. That’s NOT what’s happening here and B. Daniel and all the other socon haters here know it. To paraphrase V the K, unless the social Left stands down and stops pushing for things like gay marriage–which, we all know, the social Left has NO intention of doing–then this “truce” is a surrender.

    B. Daniel, if you and your fellow gay “conservatives” really believed in a truce in the culture war you would’ve opposed the repeal of DADT and instead insisted that Congress concentrate on the fiscal issues you pretend are more important.

    If you really believed in a truce in the culture war you’d be content with the tolerance gays have achieved and stop all efforts, including civil unions and legalized gay marriage, to force society to officially endorse homosexuality. Of course, gay “conservatives” aren’t doing any of that. Instead, you’re revelling in the successful injection of your anti-traditionalist hatred into conservatism. I hope you’re enjoying it, but don’t try to invoke the traditional values you revile when the polygamists start demanding the right to love whom they want to. Then, you’ll have to let your tolerance and diversity be your guide.

  21. Seane-Anna wants her pie, and she wants it now.

    The only “polygamists” who are “demanding” the “right” to legalize their arrangement are Islamists pushing for sharia law. Or dirty old men in Colorado City who want to marry their twelve-year-old nieces and all their little sisters. And of course, if she were to be honest, she would have to admit that she knows this.

    All the people — practically without exception — who want polygamy legalized hate the very existence of gays. Most of them want us dead. The notion that gay marriage and polygamy would ever peacefully coexist in the same country is another of her raving fantasies.

    I don’t know what she smoked when she was younger, but it must’ve been powerful stuff.

  22. As usual, Lori La La, you can’t refute what I’ve said so you resort to insults and, now, stereotyping. All polygamists are sharia law Muslims or incestuous Mormon fundamentalists? Really? And you’ve got the surveys or polls to prove that, Lori? Of course you don’t.

    “All the people — practically without exception — who want polygamy legalized hate the very existence of gays.” Again, Lori La La, support your assertion with some evidence. You can’t, and don’t plan to because you’re not interested in evidence, in facts. You’re strategizing in support of your pet cause of legitimizing homosexuality.

    The push for gay marriage naturally lends itself to the slippery slope counter argument, i.e., redefining marriage to include gay couples can and will lead to the legalizing of all other non-traditional domestic arrangements. To undercut that argument, Lori, you’ve come up with the neat trick of linking those other domestic arrangements, specifically polygamy, with perversion, religious extremism, and homophobia. You offer no evidence in support of this linkage, relying instead on the propaganda tactic of “repeat until true”.

    Unfortunately for you Lori, there are polygamists who are non-Mormon, non-Muslim, non-sharia law loving, non-related, consenting adults. If, Lori, your “libertarian” belief is that people should be free to love and marry whomever they wish, then you have no basis for restricting either the sex or the number of people who can marry. You can’t get around that problem simply by smearing as homophobic all people involved in non-gay, non-traditional domestic partnerships.

  23. In post #21, S-A accuses people of hating … but doesn’t point out any hate. S-A can you please point out an example of this “hate” you see happening?

    “There is real hatred and contempt for social conservatives here” “”B. Daniel and all the other socon haters here know it””

    So, if someone doesn’t agree with a soc-con, they’re a hater? Huh? Please explain.

  24. There is real hatred and contempt for social conservatives here, the kind you’d expect to find on the Daily Kos or the Huffington Post.

    Now, now let’s not call it “hatred” or even “contempt” but instead our own warmy and fuzzy version of “love the sinner, hate the sin”. After all, we learned from the best in how to apply this: social cons.

    On this there really is no difference between the gay Left and the gay “Right”.

    So says she who is no different than the Nanny-state Left. Nanny-staters on the Left and the Right are like peas in a pod.

    A truce in the culture war? Orwellian rubbish! A truce means all sides in a conflict lay down their weapons and STOP FIGHTING.

    If it makes you feel any better I personally could care less about any truce. I prefer the Conan approach of crushing my political enemies, seeing them driven before me and hearing the lamentation of the social cons. You guys have been doing this for most of my life now, so yeah a “truce” isn’t something I personally give a damn about.

    That’s NOT what’s happening here and B. Daniel and all the other socon haters here know it.

    Perhaps like myself, Dan only hates your sin, Madam, just like you only hate ours.

    To paraphrase V the K, unless the social Left stands down and stops pushing for things like gay marriage–which, we all know, the social Left has NO intention of doing–then this “truce” is a surrender.

    Ain’t gonna happen so get ready for the social cons’ own Appomattox, my dear.

    B. Daniel, if you and your fellow gay “conservatives” really believed in a truce in the culture war you would’ve opposed the repeal of DADT and instead insisted that Congress concentrate on the fiscal issues you pretend are more important.

    If you really believed in a truce in the culture war you’d be content with the tolerance gays have achieved and stop all efforts, including civil unions and legalized gay marriage, to force society to officially endorse homosexuality. Of course, gay “conservatives” aren’t doing any of that. Instead, you’re revelling in the successful injection of your anti-traditionalist hatred into conservatism. I hope you’re enjoying it, but don’t try to invoke the traditional values you revile when the polygamists start demanding the right to love whom they want to. Then, you’ll have to let your tolerance and diversity be your guide.

  26. “…there are polygamists who are non-Mormon, non-Muslim, non-sharia law loving, non-related, consenting adults.”

    Yes, Seane-Anna. There are probably four or five of them in any given state. What a threat they must pose!!!!

    Here you are, spluttering all over your keyboard again and frightening yourself with your own, bad science fiction.

    But I’m “smearing as homophobic” all Islamists and jack-Mormons! How dare I?

    You are so addled you can’t even follow your own argument. Whatever it is.

    Kindly put your money where your mouth is and provide evidence that teeming legions and hordes of people who are not sharia-compliers or jack-Mormons are pressing for legal polygamy. Not a random nut here or there, mind you — but the frighteningly large number you keep trying to claim are out there. And provide links.

    You are a classic troll. Though you keep repeating the same tired garbage over and over again, you can do nothing to back it up.

  28. Yeah LW, an opening to bring in my favorite graph from Nate Silver.

    and I think 5 states have the option of SSM recognition. Along with the ever increasing ‘tolerance’ and DP and Civil Union bene’s in other areas, well, I find it kind a hard to see John parsing anything.

    Now if you were look at loony planks in the Texas GOP. . .well,