GayPatriot

The Internet home for American gay conservatives.

Comments

  1. I am particularly intrigued by these two statements in the poll summary:

    Voters surveyed just before the Martin Luther King Day holiday say 31 – 21 percent that the United States is a safer place for political figures today than during Dr. King’s era, with 45 percent saying things are about the same.

    There has been “significant progress” toward Dr. King’s dream of racial equality, voters say 78 – 17 percent, including 71 – 26 percent among black voters. Race relations in the U.S. are “generally good,” voters say 64 – 27 percent, including 58 – 30 percent among black voters.

    If you took part in the King marches, you expected violence and possibly death. Where, in the United States today would this be true?

    I am pleased to read that the respondents found significant progress in racial equality. It would appear that the race-baiting, rent-a-mob leftists are losing the message.

  2. It’s amazing what a selective memory our left-liberal friends have. All that “BUSH LIED!!!(tm)” (which he did not)… “IMPEACH BUSH! ASSASSINATE BUSH!”… just forgotten, by them.

    Also, what could be more incivil, inflammatory and incendiary than throwing a charge of “Rayyysist!” every time someone disagrees with Obama?

  4. The numbers:

    Liberals more vitriolic: 8%/31%/57% = 36%
    Conservatives more vitriolic: 71%/36%/9% = 32%

    Looking at the pure mathematics (read: no partisanship), this survey was weighted in favor of conservatives (considerably more conservatives participated in survey). Each group had a number around 8.5%, the middle suggested conservatives were slightly more responsible, and the liberals pointed the finger at conservatives in greater numbers than conservatives pointed the finger at liberals.

    But, I’m sure in T-minus ?, ND30, TLW, Helio, et al. will dispute raw mathematical facts.

    Go ahead. You can dispute what I’ve asserted, but you would be wrong. Why? Because the math is there.

  5. 2nd amendment remedies?

    We came unarmed this time?

    Resorting to the ballot box before the bullet box?

    Those are just 3 off the top of my head, and they all came from Conservatives/Tea party members.

  7. Yeah Dooms? Well here you go sweetcheeks:
    ** Obama: “They Bring a Knife…We Bring a Gun”
    ** Obama to His Followers: “Get in Their Faces!”
    ** Obama on ACORN Mobs: “I don’t want to quell anger. I think people are right to be angry! I’m angry!”
    ** Obama to His Mercenary Army: “Hit Back Twice As Hard”
    ** Obama on the private sector: “We talk to these folks… so I know whose ass to kick.“
    ** Obama to voters: Republican victory would mean “hand to hand combat”
    ** Obama to lib supporters: “It’s time to Fight for it.”
    ** Obama to Latino supporters: “Punish your enemies.”
    ** Obama to democrats: “I’m itching for a fight.”

    That’s just from the President himself. Took about 30 seconds.

    You’re not very good at this.

  10. Looking at the pure mathematics (read: no partisanship), this survey was weighted in favor of conservatives (considerably more conservatives participated in survey).

    Perhaps because, quote:

    Gallup finds 42% of Americans describing themselves as either very conservative or conservative. This is up slightly from the 40% seen for all of 2009 and contrasts with the 20% calling themselves liberal or very liberal.

    Now, Vince, please state for the record that, in order for a poll to be valid, the number of people from all ideological groups in the sample must be exactly equal to each other, and that any weighting or difference in numbers based on occurrence in the population is automatically invalid.

    This is explaining so much about how Obama Party members understand science and mathematics. 🙂

  11. And yet, none of the things you mention are calls to direct violence. Those are the same things that anyone who has ever played on any kind of sports hears.

    But hey nice try, let me help you out though. Check out the latest news on Bill Filner and get back to me.

    Clearly you people choose to fall in line with the racist/homophobic/all around bigoted conservative party. Keep rolling over and taking it while the rest of us fight for our rights.

  12. ::Ahem:: and a little qoute by George Packer.

    [But it won’t do to dig up stray comments by Obama, Allen Grayson, or any other Democrat who used metaphors of combat over the past few years, and then try to claim some balance of responsibility in the implied violence of current American politics. (Most of the Obama quotes that appear in the comments were lame attempts to reassure his base that he can get mad and fight back, i.e., signs that he’s practically incapable of personal aggression in politics.) In fact, there is no balance—none whatsoever. Only one side has made the rhetoric of armed revolt against an oppressive tyranny the guiding spirit of its grassroots movement and its midterm campaign. Only one side routinely invokes the Second Amendment as a form of swagger and intimidation, not-so-coyly conflating rights with threats. Only one side’s activists bring guns to democratic political gatherings. Only one side has a popular national TV host who uses his platform to indoctrinate viewers in the conviction that the President is an alien, totalitarian menace to the country. Only one side fills the AM waves with rage and incendiary falsehoods. Only one side has an iconic leader, with a devoted grassroots following, who can’t stop using violent imagery and dividing her countrymen into us and them, real and fake. Any sentient American knows which side that is; to argue otherwise is disingenuous.]

  13. And in the meantime, I see Barack Obama has given up on calls for “civility” and insisting that rhetoric did not cause the shootings and turned loose the Obama Party operatives.

    “I’m disgusted with Republicans for helping boost a hysterical climate. An unhinged lunatic absorbed these ideas from somewhere.”

    Usually Obama waits more than two days before making it obvious he’s a liar, but the poor child is probably desperate at this point.

  16. By the way, if the left is so peaceful and reasoning, why does Obama have to use violent metaphors to “rally his base?” If the left were peaceful and reasoning, wouldn’t an appeal to brotherhood and reason be his proper means of rallying them?

    Or do appeals for peace and reason mean nothing to a political movement that has elevated mass murderers like Che Guevara and Mao Tse-Tung, and cop-killers like Mumia Abu Jamal to iconic status? You don’t see any right-wingers wearing Tim McVeigh T-shirts. But Che and Mumia are heroes to the left, and that tells you everything you need to know about the lack of moral equivalence between one side and the other.

  17. If you took part in the King marches, you expected violence and possibly death. Where, in the United States today would this be true?

    Not death, thank God, but if you are a black man selling Gasdsden “Don’t Tread on Me” flags at a conservative rally, you might very well get your ass kicked and put in the hospital by a bunch of Obama-supporting, SEIU union thug brown purple shirts.

  18. Obama’s lies in his speech just get more and more obvious.

    Look what Giffords’s own people, paid Obama Party operatives, are out there saying right now.

    “It looks like Palin, Beck, Sharron Angle and the rest got their first target,” Eric Fuller said in an interview with Democracy NOW.

    “Their wish for Second Amendment activism has been fulfilled — senseless hatred leading to murder, lunatic fringe anarchism, subscribed to by John Boehner, mainstream rebels with vengeance for all, even 9-year-old girls,” he added, referring to the death of Christina Taylor Green.

    Amazing. Giffords can barely move, yet she and her fellow Obama Party members are pushing their spokespersons and representatives out to blame Republicans by name for this shooting.

    Obama lied. There is no clearer proof than this. Obama lied in his speech. The Obama Party is attacking Republicans. The Obama Party is blaming Republicans. The Obama Party is pushing the meme that Republicans are responsible for these shootings.

  19. Hey North Dallas Thirty, take a trip down to Free Republic lately?

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2413460/posts

    Awww…look, some of them want to make it legal to kill gays here! How sweet.

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2656788/posts I bet if you replaced the word “Faggot” with “Dirty Christian” these people would be angry.

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2452759/posts They want to beat us with bats too! See how they love us?

    Some other stuff.

    Tony Perkins claiming gay teens commit suicide because “they know they are abnormal”

    Every republican voting against DADT except for a small single digit minority.

    Their defense of DOMA and ENDA

    The list goes on but really, if you can’t understand my point after all of this…well I’m never going to get through

  20. “If you took part in the King marches, you expected violence and possibly death. Where, in the United States today would this be true?”

    Being a gay/lesbian person showing any sort of affection to your partner in public (hand holding/kiss on the cheek). Just saying…

  25. Gay Ghetto? I’m unfamiliar with that term. I live in a diverse area of a major city where I’m surrounded and work with people from all walks of life.

    Now explain to me how that has anything to do with the lack of understanding that your fellow gays face?

  26. Dooms. As one who spent 4 years in WW2 I am amazed how often I read that you lefties “have to fight for your rights”. What rights do the Republicans have that you don’t. There is one right that the Republicans have. We have a right to pay our income tax. Which is something that WE DO!

  27. That’s what this comes down to for you? Money?

    And your lack of respect for what the rest of us go through is just disturbing. I am not belittling your service, yet you belittle the service that each and everyone of us give to ensuring that all gays can live safe uninterrupted lives from those who seek to harm us.

    Every kid who has the strength to come out in a bigoted highschool or household, every homo who has ever had to defend them self from bashers, every gay who was abused by being told they are evil sinful creatures as children and forced to hate themselves yet comes out stronger because of it, every gay who volunteers at their community center, stands up to the tyranny of the bible thumpers, and every single one that simply lives their life out in the open unafraid to be who they are, those are the people fighting for your right to spit on them.

  28. The denial of hate/violence thrown at your fellow gays is disturbing.

    It’s like you guys lack empathy, or any kind of awareness.

    Actually, Dooms, it’s because we’re all too aware of how gays and lesbians like you shriek for our friends, our families, and our representatives to be raped, hung, and shot because you don’t like their politics.

    In short, since you support raping and murdering people, it’s pretty obvious that you’re not opposed to hate and violence. Indeed, you like to practice it.

  29. Yeah, Dooms is pretty out of touch. I actually live with three teenagers and though none of them is gay, they do have gay friends and acquaintances. None of them worry about getting beaten up or lynched or thrown out. They concern themselves with homework and finding people to date, same as any other teenager.

    The American Heartland is not the hellhole of bigotry and violence urban “sohpisticates” like Dooms like to tell themselves it is.

  30. Or, Dooms is just a big drama queen who imagines that his sexual orientation makes him part of some big struggle against oppression or something. I guess living in a fantasy of oppression makes life bearable if you have nothing else going for you.

  31. And your lack of respect for what the rest of us go through is just disturbing.

    BWHAHAHAHAHA!

    Hey Dooms, did you ever think about WHY we don’t get “harassed” and “attacked” like you do?

    Probably because we don’t go around calling investigation of child molesters “homophobia”.

    Probably because we don’t go around insisting that companies who fire gays and lesbians for sexual harassment are “homophobic”.

    And probably because we don’t go around vandalizing churches, violently interrupting church services, or calling for Republicans/conservatives and their families to be raped, hung, and shot.

    Do you really think you deserve anything other than utter contempt for those behaviors? Don’t you realize that the Obama Party belief that minority status allows you to commit whatever crime you want and walk is racist/sexist/etc.?

  32. This whole debate makes me want to jump off a bridge. Does it really matter if liberals or conservatives are more responsible? Only 9% of the people in the survey thought this spree was political. Let’s keep politics out of the grieving process and move on. What say you?

  33. Hey again Northy (I feel like you and I are getting to be on a nick name basis, feel free to call me Doomsie or even Smood!)

    I wonder why I can produce incident after incident to back up my claims of rightwing hatred…and you can only produce the same two pieces? I mean I haven’t even brought up how many effigy’s were burned at tea party rallies, nooses sent to black politicians, and calls to violence against liberals in general.

    What this tells me is that you know that this is false equivalency, you simply choose to ignore that fact. You seem fairly intelligent, surely you know the difference between the hate being echoed on the right, and a small number of people on the left making their own words known.

  34. So Northy, you are claiming you don’t get attacked because you roll over and take it from those who clearly hate you?

    How about the gay community centers firebombed, vandalized, workers attacked?

    You really want to compare a few instances of FED UP gays to the vitriol, violence, and hate that many gays face day to day?

  35. #34 Dooms:

    I mean I haven’t even brought up how many effigy’s were burned at tea party rallies, nooses sent to black politicians, and calls to violence against liberals in general.

    Dooms, you would be an idiot non pareil to send such proof here. The leftist media will make you rich for this proof. Get on it man. Be a capitalist.

  36. V the K, It makes me happy that the gay teens your teens know don’t fear for their lives/saftey.

    That’s the way it should be and that’s the way the rest of us want to make it. You see your life is the exception, not the rule. Please remember that.

  37. the way the rest of us want to make it.

    By teaching gay teens that the world outside the ghetto is hostile and dangerous, everybody hates them, and if their parents don’t agree with their lifestyle choices they’re being oppressed and should ditch out.

  39. Wow. Doops was failing miserably with his lies that Republicans shot Giffords, so he has to change the subject?

    And yet, none of the things you mention are calls to direct violence.

    If you weren’t such a lying, disgraceful piece of shit, you’d be aware that none of the things you mention are calls to direct violence. Not a damn one.

    if you can’t understand my point after all of this…well I’m never going to get through

    We don’t speak moonbatshitcrazy. Do you have a translator?

  40. V the K, what exactly do you mean by “Lifestyle choices”?

    Any clarification would be AWESOME, also what is a “Gay Ghetto”? I don’t think I’ve ever been to one, but in my experience major cities/college towns are accepting of gays.

    I guess that’s why many gays go there.

  42. And let Dooms not forget that the left actively “Mobyed” the rallies so many of the “Hatred” images coming out the the TEA rallies are false flag operations by the left, and even some of the extremist nuts who were not leftists were actively ostracized at the rallies.
    If the TEA party and the Right as a whole is so violent, why then are all the riots, arrests, and violent rallies left protests and gatherings? Even at the Dem convention, all the violence was leftist related.

  43. what exactly do you mean by “Lifestyle choices”?

    I mean staying out all night, cutting school, experimenting with drugs, and hanging out with bad influences. Some gay activists may feel that these are all part of “a journey of personal discovery.” The safe school czar, for example, thought it was not a big deal for a teenage boy to running off and meeting strange men in public restrooms. Parents may feel differently.

  44. Whoa whoa, Thatgayconservative, why the need for name calling?

    Why don’t you stay on subject? Why don’t you provide evidence of your claims instead of bullshit? Why are you wasting space on a good blog?

  45. So Northy, you are claiming you don’t get attacked because you roll over and take it from those who clearly hate you?

    I do so laugh.

    According to Dooms, if you oppose child molestation, you are “rolling over and taking it”.

    If you criticize calling for Sarah Palin to be raped, hung, and shot, you are “rolling over and taking it”.

    If you oppose sexually harassing your coworkers, you are “rolling over and taking it”.

    If you believe others have the right to their own beliefs and services and should not have their houses of worship vandalized, you are “rolling over and taking it”.

    The problem here is very simple. Gays and lesbians like Dooms are psychotic individuals who are incapable of even following basic rules of society because of their sexual orientation.

  46. V the K you do know those are al things straight youth do as well right?

    Personally i’m only guilty of staying out all night. Then again I’m an adult. I did cut school, but unlike my straight classmates it wasn’t to drink, it was to avoid having to defend myself.

  49. “I’m disgusted with Republicans for helping boost a hysterical climate. An unhinged lunatic absorbed these ideas from somewhere.”

    Once again, being lost sight of is the fact that Loughner was, IF ANYTHING, MORE OF A LEFTIST.

    I don’t care if it’s one of the victims who is getting his/her facts wrong there, or not. Incorrect is still incorrect.

  50. Dooms! Are you serious?

    You can attempt to write it off as liberal crap, but unless you can dispute the evidence, well then you’re just going to have to deal with the fact that it’s…fact.

    If this TalkingPointsMemo didn’t make the front page of the New York Times and out of the MSNBC waste can to the NBC nightly news, it must really be swamp gas. Neither the New York Times nor NBC Nightly News has particularly journalistic standards, so where does that leave your “proof?”

    Dooms, anyone can imply anything on the net. The world does not work on the basis of “unless you can dispute the evidence, well then you’re just going to have to deal with the fact that it’s…fact.”

    Dooms robs hospital nurseries and sucks blood from newborns. Now it is up to you to disprove it. Until you do, it is fact. Oh, and do you still feed on your own waste?

  51. JP, it wasn’t tea partiers who threw bags of cement from overpasses onto buses at the RNC convention. It wasn’t tea partiers who vandalized military recruiting headquarters in Berkeley, Milwaukee, and NYC. It was a fan of Media Matters, not Glenn Beck, that shot up a school board meeting in Florida. It’s not the right-wing that destroys property and riots when the WTO comes to town. It isn’t Tea Partiers who terrorize the families of animal researchers.

    There’s no moral equivalence here. Asserting that Rush Limbaugh expressing the desire that Obama should fail to implement socialism is exactly equally hateful to Democrat Congressman (!) Paul Kanjorski calling for the execution of the Republican Governor of Florida is pure nonsense.

  52. You really want to compare a few instances of FED UP gays to the vitriol, violence, and hate that many gays face day to day?

    Yes I do.

    Because your behavior makes it obvious that you endorse and support vitriol, violence, and hate when carried out by gay and lesbian people. You support rape and murder when called for and carried out by gays and lesbians. You whine and cry that gays and lesbians should never be held accountable for any behavior because they’re “oppressed”.

    You want preferential treatment based on minority status. That makes you anti-equality and a bigot.

  53. Does it really matter if liberals or conservatives are more responsible?

    Yes. Because what the lefties are after here, is to shut down the American people’s dissent against leftism. ObamaCare alone could ultimately (note ‘ultimately’) cost millions of people their lives.

    Let’s keep politics out of the grieving process and move on.

    Please tell that to the Left. Call them to account for their false (and malicious) efforts in this matter.

  55. V, are you making stuff up? because it seems like you are parroting modified anti-gay talking points.

    Nope, I am reporting what I have witnessed and what I have read in the type of literature groups like GLSEN traffic in. These are not “anti-gay” talking points, they are “anti-screwing up kids” positions that I hold and that are apparently not widely held among teh gheys.

  56. TGC can’t yo be civil? I gave proof, take it or leave it bu facts are facts.

    You gave SHIT. Shit is shit. You’ve got nothing. Sell your hate to your DUmmie circle jerk.

  57. Conservatives and Independents did what is required in November. They routed the leftists in every way possible, peaceably at the polls. With the liberals in control of one less House of Congress, now we are all suppose to calm down, lower the volume and dial it all back somewhat because the liberals and left wing media are losing more control. Why weren’t there calls for people to be more civil when there were death threats and death books and death movies directed towards Bush 43?
    And by the way. I hear Obama and Michelle are going to raise ONE BILLION dollars for the 2012 Presidential run. $1 Billion. If we are going to be more civil, nice and polite, what in the world does Obama need all that money for?
    I think you can look to the 2010 campaign and see how nice and civil Obama is going to be.

  59. So it’s settled, what everyone says is true. You people are nothing but self loathing Aunty Toms.

    LOL….and what should we do then, Dooms, “roll over and take it” from people like you who clearly hate us?

    It is endlessly hilarious to me how Dooms and his fellow gay leftists shriek about the evils of social pressure and ostracism while mercilessly (and futilely) trying to apply both to bring gays and lesbians who don’t follow the Obama Party line to heel.

    Call me whatever you like, Dooms. At least I don’t need to make excuses for child molesters, rapists, murderers, vandals, and bigots because they share my sexual orientation.

  61. Northy this must be said. The people who want preferential are the ones waving around bibles demanding we adhere to their faith.

    Oh, and out comes the antireligious bigotry.

    Know what, Dooms? The Constitution forbids you from discriminating against people because of their religious beliefs. The fact that you do so only proves how incapable gays and lesbians like yourself are of living in a civilized and ordered society.

  66. Also Dooms, didn’t you say it was “time to go” back at comment #59?

    See, that’s the thing with some of you lefties. You don’t have a leg to stand on. Hand-in-hand with that, you can’t keep your given word. The two go together.

  67. You people are nothing but self loathing Aunty Toms.

    C’mon. Libs have no problem calling folks like Condi Rice a “nigger”. Can’t you do better than “Aunty Toms”?

  68. #28 Dooms:

    yet you belittle the service that each and everyone of us give to ensuring that all gays can live safe uninterrupted lives from those who seek to harm us.

    Where the HECK do you live??????

    Why don’t you and all your pals have broken legs from tripping over the cables the liberal TV people have spread around watching the gay bashing, slaughtering, maiming, burning, hanging, barbed wire beatings, etc.?

    You, sir, are a liar. But you are in the correct political party. Now go get your pity party all riled up. And have a nice day.

  72. Eric Fuller said in an interview with Democracy NOW.

    So they’re gonna circle the wagons around a guy they would HATE if he wasn’t a lying sack of shit. It’s John F.You Kerry (who served in Vietnam) all over again.

  74. Dooms is just a big drama queen who imagines that his sexual orientation makes him part of some big struggle against oppression or something. I guess living in a fantasy of oppression makes life bearable

    DING DING DING DING DING!

    The entire regressive gay left cant deal with being different, so they lie to themselves and delude themselves into believing that a sexuality that has never produced any life in the entire history of the world is equal to the sexuality that has produced all life on the planet throughout all of history.

    They delude themselves into believe that earth shattering difference is instead inconsequential and that the two are actually exactly the same. They delude themselves into believing the sexes are interchangeable so they can pretend that two dads is equivalent to a mom and a dad, when their very own fixed sexual orientation proves that the sexes are NOT interchangeable.

    It is the LEFT that is self loathing, and have to lie to themselves in order to make it through the day (not to mention addle their brains with all sorts of drugs) because they are too afraid to come to terms with their own sexuality, and the inescapable, irrefutable fact that it is scientifically, consequentially monumentally, meaningfully different.

  75. By the way, anyone else notice the major uptick in liberals lashing out, not just here, but just about every conservative blog?

    They are truly coming unglued. They have lost the power and control over others that they think is their birthright, their policies are failing catastrophically all over the place. Everything they have touched has turned to shit — and when they thought they could use this tragedy for political gain — it backfired in their faces, and polls show Americans see it for the reprehensible opportunism that it is, and Americans recognize that the left is MUCH more responsible for the nasty political atmosphere. Americans are abandoning the Democrat party in droves. And the liberal press has destroyed outright what little credibility it had left.

    They are seriously losing it.

    And if they think things are bad for them now, just wait til the house starts doing their job and investigating the causes of the financial collapse and holding this corrupt Chicago administration accountable!

  77. Soon enough the libs will be here complaining about all the insults, ad hominems and straw men. They have that escape hatch written on all their monitors.

    TGC asks: “With all this bullshit about civility, has there been any liberals who’ve condemned the death threats against Palin?”

    The answer is: “TGC resorts to insults, ad hominems and straw men rather than deal with issue.”

    TGC says: The sun rises in the east and sets in the west.

    The response is: “There he goes again with his insults, ad hominems and straw men.

  78. What I find really interesting about the results is that by really clear margins (pretty clearly outside the margin of error), liberals think conservatives are responsible (71 to 8%) whilst conservatives think that liberals are responsible but by a lesser amount (57 to 9%). The other thing is that moderates break 31 to 36 on the issue, for a 36 to 32% total result, with 32% undecided. That is a big undecided block. Yet, when the report says that “A total of 581 voters were questioned about the shooting with a margin of error of +/- 4.1 percent” I am uncertain how it is that Quinnipac can make the claim it does about who is more responsible for heated rhetoric. When you factor in the margin of error (even something a little over + or – 2%) one cannot escape the conclusion that the survey over-reached itself. Reynolds’ claim may be accurate, but we can’t tell from this survey. It is a statistically meaningless claim. We need more surveys before we can make a definitive judgement about what the public really thinks.

  79. #78 Which begs the question whether or not I care.

    Further, there’s no way the Republicans should sit with these opportunistic bastards at the SOTU as long as they continue to stoke the fire under their moonbatshitcrazy douche nozzles they call their base.

  80. They shouldnt sit with them for any reason. Its just a ruse to make it look like more people are approving his speech than really are.

    Its important for Americans to be able to see which politicians approve of which policies.

    If the chamber is divided and Democrats stand up, and republicans sit down, its clear that most of congress disapproves. If they are mixed and Democrats stand up and Republicans sit down, the people sitting down will be obscured by those standing up, and Obama comes off looking like every loved everything he had to say.

  81. Growing up politically, – I early concluded that most of the crazies are on my side of the political spectrum if you agree to the left-right axis. Just as I had to come to terms with the fact that a lot of my cultural heroes and favorite books came from the left.

    I know in my heart I am a conservative and I can state this without hating myself. Believe it or not but this is not complicated.

    A lot of you who comment regularly on this site seem to think that you have to subscribe to the whole Althouse/Beck/Palin/Malkin -rhetoric to be a true conservative. But that is a misunderstanding. And I believe that Eisenhower, Reagan and Burke would agree with me.

    Now if the talking heads could please go away, we might win the next election.That would be very considerate thank you.

  82. A lot of you who comment regularly on this site seem to think that you have to subscribe to the whole Althouse/Beck/Palin/Malkin -rhetoric to be a true conservative.

    Such as?

  83. Also, what could be more incivil, inflammatory and incendiary than throwing a charge of “Rayyysist!” every time someone disagrees with Obama?

    It isn’t that conservatives occasionally disagree with Obama that you guys have earned the racist label as of late. It’s because of very specific episodes where the conservative line of attack on Obama is explicitly racist; i.e., the drummed-up Rev. Wright controversy, the Shirley Sherrod fiasco that still stands as a massive humiliation for this blog in particular, Glenn Beck’s out-of-left-field ‘deep-seeded hatred of white people’ nonsense, as well as the far too typical impression by lots of conservatives and tea partiers that Obama is a foreigner or a Muslim. Each one of these conservative attacks hinges on Obama’s skin color and could not be made if he was a white guy.

    There’s other stuff, too – like the ACORN hysteria and a tendency to blame the financial collapse on low-income minorities – but that isn’t specific to Obama’s presidency and is something of a latent feature of American conservatism, held over from the Civil Rights era. But it isn’t as if there are liberals going around accusing Republicans of racism because they don’t like Obama’s healthcare policy.

  84. TGC@83
    Such as it doesn’t seem to be much room for disagreement. For me these people(Althouse et al) do more harm than good for the political discourse. Is that okay with you? Can you debate me as a fellow conservative despite that?

    The tone on this site can be extremely vile. And such an atmosphere is not ideal if you wan’t a straight talk. I am trying to sort out the level of interest in a healthy discussion(which can seem pretty low more often than not).

    I would also be happy to see any comments from Blatt in this regard.

  85. Now if the talking heads could please go away, we might win the next election.

    Because the MFM always treats Republican candidates with fairness and decency and the RNC is a masterpiece of competence.

    Johnny, make sure you feed that unicorn that lives in your backyard. It’s the only way he’ll poop enough rainbows and fairy dust for your scenario to come to pass.

  86. Johnny G @85:

    The tone on this site can be extremely vile. And such an atmosphere is not ideal if you wan’t a straight talk.

    Who are specific people you would you like to censor?

    What straight talk would you like to engage? Topics, please.

    At what level of discourse does disagreement become “extremely vile” and do you credit Dan with failing to properly moderate?

    Johnny G @82:

    A lot of you who comment regularly on this site seem to think that you have to subscribe to the whole Althouse/Beck/Palin/Malkin -rhetoric to be a true conservative. But that is a misunderstanding. And I believe that Eisenhower, Reagan and Burke would agree with me.

    Color me confused.

    Althouse/Beck/Palin/Malkin and Limbaugh/ Hannity/ Levin/ Coulter/ Ingraham/etc. are pundits. (Extraordinarily well read pundits, I might add.)

    Eisenhower and Reagan were politicians who had to lead an entire country, not just the conservatives.

    I assume you are speaking of Edmund Burke who regrettably must be kept out of the argument, because he was toying with a model that no longer applies. He was, according to Churchill, an “apostle of liberty” and a “champion of authority” at the same time. He was skeptical of democracy and a classical liberal. He was an important root of modern conservatism, even though Lord Acton considered him one of the three greatest liberals in English Parliamentary history.

    I hardly think we need to turn away from nationalized health care, automobile company bailouts, the political tone, etc. to banter about the ever contradictory Edmund Burke. Hopefully, my tone here has not approached being vile.

    In sum, my confusion is how one lumps pundits, Presidents and a political theorists together and comes out with a model. Politics is cross pollenated by a vast array of vocal and written influences. How you can purify it for the purposes of the salon and managed debate is beyond my comprehension.

    Beck has a huge following. I wonder why an equally entertaining “rodeo clown” does not take his totally on the record show and rip him a new one every day for all the supposed stupidity, lies, vile rhetoric, demagoguery, misapplication, malfeasance, and pandering he is accused of letting loose. It would seem that MSNBC could get huge audiences who would come to watch them undress Beck in public.

    The same goes for even Johnny G who could take the latest Malkin column and massage it with Burke and Eisenhower and Reagan and expose Malkin to the Johnny G level of straight talk. Its a free net, so far.

  87. Levi @84 on “our” racism:

    the drummed-up Rev. Wright controversy

    Which is what?

    Shirley Sherrod fiasco that still stands as a massive humiliation for this blog in particular

    Which is what? And what is the massive humiliation?

    Glenn Beck’s out-of-left-field ‘deep-seeded [sic] hatred of white people’ nonsense

    Which is what and how was whatever it was shown to be nonsense?

    the far too typical impression by lots of conservatives and tea partiers that Obama is a foreigner or a Muslim

    And just how has the impression has been totally debunked?

    Each one of these conservative attacks hinges on Obama’s skin color and could not be made if he was a white guy

    Huh? Did Father Pfleger turn black?

    A radical leftist white guy President could have drunk deeply from the cup of Rev. Wright and be all Plegerized with liberation theology. Empathy is a main-stay of liberalism. Affirmative Action is a liberal cornerstone.

    A radical leftist white guy President could have appointed and backed Shirley Sherrod and participated the great Pigford scam. After all, Clinton was the first “black” President.

    A radical leftist self-loathing bisexual white guy President could have been nailed with Glenn Beck style “out-of-left-field ‘deep-seeded [sic] hatred of white people’ nonsense.” Liberals are the go-to people for identifying self-loathers.

    A white guy President could easily be the source of “a far too typical impression” that he is “a foreigner of a Muslim.” Unless white guys can not be Muslims and only coloreds are foreigners, this one in particular is a non-starter.

    Looks like Levi is in the Dooms school of making the charges and it is up to us to disprove the charges.

    That works both ways, pal. In the “where there is smoke, there is fire” school of logic, Obama is weighted down with the negative association with Rev. Wright, Sherrod/Pigford retribution, psychological profiles, hidden birth certificate/writings/data/etc. Lots of smoke. No effort to release the documents. When did Obama disavow liberation theology? He only threw Rev. Wright under the bus for screeching three specific words. Liberation theology is racist. (Ooops! Maybe you can educate me on how it is not racist.)

    Without further wasted effort on my part, I will just request that Levi come back by and make his case. Of course, he can’t, so he will either disappear on this or return to move the topic.

  88. Heliotrope@87
    Thanks for the effort, but you seem to get it wrong. When commenting on the tone(as GayPatriot also did on the Beck-pledge post), I merely try to dip my toes in the water to check if this is the right place to have a good discussion or not.

    You know when a parent tells a kid “You have to be home by ten”, and the kid answers “You don’t want me to have any fun!”, the logic might seem obvious at the time for the kid. But it isn’t ofcourse. When I comment on the destructive tone in some of the threads here, it isn’t a call for censorship or a critique of the lack of moderation, at all.

  89. Well, Johnny G, I think everyone would always be interested in your comments and willing to say why they agree or disagree. Personally, I think it is better to stay away from absolutes, because you can not disagree with an absolute without denying it in its entirety. Some commenters just do not understand that. There is no argument with, for example: “Sarah Palin is completely stupid.” You might ask for evidence of stupidity, but when you are told she is completely stupid, it is a pontification and beyond discussion.

    There are some very well read, bright, thoughtful, commenters here. If you get challenged, consider it a challenge. It is the continued beatings of a dead horse that usually draw the sarcasm.

    I do believe that you can read or listen to Beck, Palin, Malkin, Coulter, Blatt, Limbaugh, et. al. and learn a great deal. You may not always agree or even sometimes, but you better understand a point of view. That should help sharpen your own.

  90. Ah, Levi’s trying the big lie again. Rev Wright is a nice old pastor, Levi’s still sulking that he couldn’t lie his way out of his baseless accusations that Fox ‘went after’ Sherrod (the only failure on that was Levi’s) and his other lies and bile.

    Lies and bile are all that our resident racist have left.

    And let’s not forget that the man calling the right racists is the one who said that brown people can’t understand democracy.

    but that the idea that you can force democracy on a people as alien to the concept as Arabians was utterly ridiculous.

    See, this is the easiest way to debunk Levi’s cries of racism. If the right were really racist, he’d get along with us.

  91. Levi >> No, because racists don’t exist in this country. And there aren’t any in the Tea Party. Never have, never will. And Bush didn’t squander a federal surplus.