In an interview with the Daily Caller’s Jamie Weinstein, Harry Stein, author of, I Can’t Believe I’m Sitting Next To A Republican, recently released in paperback, offers an anecdote which corresponds with the experience of this blogger — and many of our readers. Answering the question, “What is it like being a Republican in San Francisco?“, he offers
Well, as one (gay) Republican I spoke to out there put it, it’s a lot easier to be gay in San Francisco than a Republican, adding that when he came out as a Republican “friends abandoned me. I got called a fascist, traitor, crazy, insane, a racist.” In the Bizarro World that is San Francisco, fascism is always around the corner and that great bogeyman, the Christian Right, is just waiting to pounce.
Our experience has shown, it’s far easier to be openly gay in conservative circles than it is to be openly conservative in gay circles. To be sure, we have also met many dyed-in-the-wool left-wingers who treat us with dignity despite our political differences, but there is a common thread running through the anecdotes of our interactions with our fellow gays, stories of individuals insulting, attacking or otherwise avoiding us because of our political opinions. And they tell us as much to our faces. Often in the nastiest terms.
Via reader Viking the Kitten.
Being conservative in SF is an experience to be sure.
It was rather odd, working in the hotel/hospitality industry I am used to working with a number of gay and/or liberal men. But the one time I worked in SF I found there were no Gay men working my shifts and nearly every one was Conservative. It was a bit of an alternate universe vibe.
I’ve already mentioned the reaction I got from my friends at one of the local bars when I said I was probably going to vote for Bush in 2000…
Lets just say I would have gotten a kinder response if I would have declared that I love to rape kittens!!!!
And it’s a lot easier to be Republican (rather than gay or liberal) in Bakersfield, Orange County, the Inland Empire, or quite frankly, almost any place in the U.S. that is not urban.
Places like San Francisco are liberal places whose residents (straight & gay) vote overwhelmingly for Democrats. That’s not going to change in the foreseeable future.
Nobody is forcing gay conservatives to live in San Francisco, West Hollywood, Santa Monica, Georgetown, Manhattan, or any other liberal enclaves. If you don’t like living with liberal gay folk, and would rather have socially conservative Republicans as the majority of your neighbors, you have the freedom to pack your bags and move!
If a majority of Democrats can believe that Palin’s target map had something to do with the Arizona shootings – while the DNC’s own, equally militant target-shooting map did not, of course – then Democrats can believe anything:
http://hotair.com/archives/2011/01/17/cnn-poll-majority-of-dems-35-overall-think-palins-crosshairs-map-is-at-least-partly-to-blame-for-arizona-shootings/
And that, in turn, might explain why so many Democrats are intolerant. (I.e., when someone suffers from *that* much stupidity… or that much irresponsibility/malice… anything is possible…)
Oh poor, you! How dare people disagree with your politics?
Suggestion: Google “rental agent” and “Hollywood, Alabama.” That way you can have the ‘Hollywood’ cachet and feel right at home surrounded by your fellow conservatives.
(continued) as Auntie Dogmatic gives proof, daily. 😉
FTR lefties, all that Dan has done is state a simple fact of his experience, that:
It’s interesting how your comments *don’t* address it.
Miss Dogma, methinks you should read posts before commenting. It’s not disagreement as you might understand if you read this line in my very short post, “To be sure, we have also met many dyed-in-the-wool left-wingers who treat us with dignity despite our political differences”.
All that said, almost your every comment helps make the point I raise in the post to which you attach this latest one.
So, I guess, thanks are in order.
Nobody is forcing gay conservatives to live in San Francisco, West Hollywood, Santa Monica, Georgetown, Manhattan, or any other liberal enclaves. If you don’t like living with liberal gay folk, and would rather have socially conservative Republicans as the majority of your neighbors, you have the freedom to pack your bags and move!
Indeed.
And if you don’t like living in a place without gay-sex marriage, thought-crime laws, or employment quotas for gays and lesbians, then you have the freedom to pack your bags and move instead of whining and demanding that the laws be changed to accomodate you and calling those who disagree bigots.
Watch how quickly moonbat James reverses himself on that one. All of a sudden, having everything exactly the way you want it will become a “right”, and you will have the power to force your neighbors to do what you like.
Recently went to dinner at my son’s house. He and his partner are having some tight times financially and got another room mate. Never having felt strange around gays I wonder if Auntie Dogma can understand my feelings when my son’s new roommate unloaded on me over my conservative views? Not just unload, went ballistic.
My son, and his partner, are center-left, and we appreciate each other’s political views but if you are straight and conservative, you will be treated like you are carrying the plague by the liberal gay community.
So please take a note, AUNTIE DOGMA, if you are unwilling to be tolerant of others, be damn sure you are not demanding tolerance of others.
Auntie Dogma returns to vomit all over Gaypatriot. I see you have learned nothing from Darkseid or Granny Goodness. You’re more like Mad Harriet.
Mom of a Gay Guy! Yay!!! I’m with you all the way. Only difference is that my gay son is conservative – but it a lot younger than yours (just graduated college).
As for Auntie and James, if you two really enjoy living in a
hermetically sealed box where everyone is a carbon copy – go ahead. Most of us love diversity, especially of thought – we don’t want cookie cutter neighbors, we want people who share certain values (like keeping up a decent neighborhood to live in) and if we disagree, we’d love a civil discussion, but with the likes of you, I doubt either will happen.
I live in super-blue Los Angeles and I’m and English professor. Also, a conservative.
I haven’t found it that hard to be conservative. You just defend your viewpoints and listen to the opposing side and then move on to less controversial topics. What’s the big deal?
While I don’t think I agree with James on much, he is right that you don’t have to live in cosmopolitan gay meccas if you don’t want to. You can move to Palmdale, San Jose, Staten Island, or other places in major urban centers where policemen, veterans, and retired car dealership owners live. Then your Republicanism won’t be an issue — but you’ll have to deal with some difficulties surrounding being gay.
For crying out loud, right-wingers are starting to whine almost as much as gay activists do. Not a good trend.
“Not everyone is going to like you.” Advice from 7th grade when I didn’t get invited to a birthday party for the cool kids. Still applies.
It looks as though (self-proclaimed) “conservative” “English professors” may also have trouble reading and understanding the post to which they attach their comments.
Auntie Dogma and the Westboro Baptist Church…. people awfully darn proud of their intolerance.
“Not everyone is going to like you.” (H/T R.O. Lopez)
Sounds like something that Auntie should be hearing on a daily basis.
Regards,
Peter H.
So are libs now trying to bury all of last week?
The club mentality exists even in Arizona, but there are so many conservatives here that when I get flak from those in “the community” about my convictions, I have the luxury of merely saying, “then move somewhere else.”
They complain about the politics, but almost all of them love it here. I try to get them to connect the dots between why they love it here and the politics they love to hate.
A lot of it boils down to what they want to believe about themselves. They have heard, for years, that if they want to be with it, hip and urbane, they will be Leftist. This has as much to do with reality with wanting to be Batman, going to Charlie’s House of Fun and buying a Batman costume and running around town proclaiming that they’re Batman.
I just tell them, “Good luck with that.” Sometimes you can do no more.
I think I understand the reluctance of left liberals to bear the presence of conservatives. Progressivism is based on not much more than half-baked theories, talking points, and untruths that are easily dispatched within minutes of Levi posting them. Liberalism can’t stand up to scrutiny, so those who espouse that philosophy can’t bear the presence of those who might challenge them. They only want to be surrounded with like-minded people.
Otherwise, they might have to defend the proposition, for example, that Barack Obama is entitled to a higher standard of civility than George W. Bush. Most awkward, as you can imagine.
@NorthDallasThirty,
Even though you think I’m a “moonbat,” it may surprise you that I actually DO agree with you with what you said above. If someone is gay and doesn’t like the fact that their state is overwhelmingly conservative and doesn’t recognize same-sex unions or does not provide legal protections for sexual orientation/gender identity, that person has the freedom to move somewhere else (or seek employment elsewhere), if he or she so chooses.
That person also has the right to air their grievances to elected officials, their employers, or the public at-large, but that does not guarantee that said grievances will be addressed, or that a positive outcome result.
For example, you can try to speak out in favor of gay civil unions in strongly Republican states such as Kansas & Oklahoma, but there will probably be a backlash of social conservatives against you, and it won’t happen. But would that really be a surprise? You knew what you were getting into.
You can also try to urge the Berkeley (Calif.) city council to issue a proclamation of support for US Marines in Afghanistan. There will probably be a backlash of anti-war & Code Pink type of people against you. Would that be a surprise either? You knew what you were getting into, there too.
@Leah,
I do have the ability to have civil discussion.
I personally like diversity too. The thing is, is that places like San Francisco and West Hollywood, are so overwhelmingly Democrat, that about 75 to 80% of the residents consistently support the Democratic Party. In addition, a lot of the residents in those areas are very outspoken about their politically liberal views. That doesn’t sound too diverse (politically, at least) to me.
So, quite frankly, it’s not much of a surprise that gay Republicans (or straight Republicans either) don’t receive a warm welcome in places like San Francisco or West Hollywood. Far left liberals don’t receive a warm welcome in Fresno, Bakersfield, Orange County, or the Inland Empire either. Is that right? Not really. But that’s the way it is.
Yea, I mean obviously you all have experienced what you have, but I live in a pretty liberal city, have many gay friends, liberal and conservative, and haven’t seen this conservative gay hate you speak of. Most people seem to just care if you’re a fun interesting person. If you like Sarah Palin, then so be it.
Conservatives tend to be more politely tolerant of differing opinions, much less likely to ruin a dinner party by calling someone names like “racist” “fascist” or what have ye.
When courts impose gay marriage by judicial fiat, you don’t see conservatives going around rioting in the streets or vandalizing gay bars. Liberals could not quite be restrained from doing so after the passage of Proposition 8.
@V the K,
That’s great! Since conservatives are much more “politely tolerant” than liberals, I’m hoping that gay conservatives will be welcomed by their new prospective neighbors in places like Bakersfield or the Inland Empire, or anywhere in “Red state America,” should gay conservatives ever get tired of whining about being accepted more by conservatives than other (liberal) gay folk.
James, if a conservative wants to live in Weho, or SF that is their choice. Having open minded lefties telling them to move tell me that the lefties are the ones with the problem.
The left came out screaming this week about civility, but really all it means is they want their little ghettos unsullied by any one who thinks differently.
The conservatives aren’t in their face, they simply want to co-exist.
They don’t want to move to Palmdale, they want to live where they are without their neighbors having a hissy fit cuz they don’t ‘fit in’.
I should know, I was very welcoming to a gay couple that moved next door, had them over to the house a number of times, tried to be open and friendly – but my politics got in their way – not my actions. They simply started to shun me, until one day they were gone – I hope their new neighbors are lovely liberals who play loud music all night – as long as the politics match -nothing else matters.
Aw, I was gonna eviscerate James, but I see NDT has already done so! 🙁
C’mon libs, say something stupid just for me!
and Leah!
Oh really? How so? Bet they dont treat you anything even remotely like this.
Yes, conservatives are so tolerant of the gays. Sad thing is, apparently even just being suspected of being gay was enough for these kind Christians to kick them, or any other gays, back out on the streets.
Obviously, since they’re so tolerant, conservatives would allow their kids to intermingle with other gay kids without a problem.
Or they’d cancel their prom, lie to the gay teen, hold their own prom and then get sued for being bigots.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36178446/ns/us_news-life/
Or they’d ban the gays they tolerate so much and hope they’d just stand for it. Too bad for them the courts forced them to be allowed to attend at the last second.
http://gayteens.about.com/b/2008/04/02/alabama-teen-lesbians-allowed-to-attend-prom-at-the-last-minute.htm
Turns out even when the gays are allowed to attend, parents and students don’t want their town being known as “pro gay”, so they’ll protest instead and the tolerant parents will kick their gay teen out.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2480687/posts
Apparently some intolerance isn’t as strong as other’s and the simple threat of media intervention and legal action is enough to get the bigoted school districts to cave in.
http://www.towleroad.com/2010/04/gay-nc-teens-allowed-to-go-to-prom-after-cool-mom-steps-in.html
But surely when people want to simply wear purple in support of LGBT youth that committed suicide a public school board member wouldn’t have a problem tolerating that. O wait..
http://www.examiner.com/progressive-in-milwaukee/arkansas-school-board-member-displays-horrible-homophobic-bigotry-it-gets-better-project
Turns out maybe it’s just as hard, if not harder, being gay in a conservative environment than it is being conservative in a gay environment. It’s terrible that it happens at all, but acting like it’s simply a huge liberal issue thing is completely ridiculous.
Actually AJ, your own report says they were kicked out for violating curfew. And it is a place that obviously has very strict rules, including no heterosexual couples unless they have been married at least 2 or 3 years.
Now you want to compare a private home, which claims it welcomes gay people, provided they follow the rules while they are there, to a screaming mob, rocking cars, beating a Christian woman with her own Bible and knocking her to the ground, and chasing them out of an entire neighborhood, off PUBLIC streets?
Please. Could you be any more ridiculous?
I like how James is under the impression that certain parts of the country ‘belong’ to people of specific lifestyle or political bents; and how citizens who don’t agree with a certain bigoted outlook need to give up any thoughts of equality… and flee.
Yay for ethnic cleansing, James!
@Leah,
Thanks for sharing your story about your former gay neighbors in your liberal neighborhood. Let me share one of my stories. The suburb where I grew up in Orange County (and where my parents still reside) is overwhelmingly Republican & conservative, and voted about 80% yes on Prop 8. Even though I moved away to college, I would still tutor high school kids in my parent’s neighborhood during spring & summer breaks. I was doing well & received nothing but praise from the kids & the parents. All of a sudden I started losing clients. I asked one of the parents (who was a family friend) if something was wrong. He said, “You’re doing a good job, but I just can’t risk having someone living your kind of lifestyle around my kids.” I found out later that someone had “outed” me to the parents of the neighborhood, even though I never, not even once, mentioned anything regarding my sexual orientation to my students or their parents. I had not even yet told my family that I was gay.
What was I supposed to do at that point? Should I have gotten frustrated & angry and told those parents to judge me for my own actions & character, rather than their disapproval of homosexuality in general? Apparently their need to not have a gay person around their kids was greater than my skills or abilities (which were perfectly fine before they found out from the rumor mill that I was gay). But at the same time, I can’t force people to like me. Some people may be closed-minded to people with different political views; other people may not accept people with a different sexual orientation. So what did I do? I forced myself to put a smile on my face, and I moved on.
So yes, from my personal experience, it is much easier to be a Republican or conservative in places like Orange County, than it is to be gay or liberal in those places.
Obviously, since they’re so tolerant, conservatives would allow their kids to intermingle with other gay kids without a problem.
Notice how AJ and liberal gays like himself have a common thread in all their arguments: the promiscuous teenager is always right, and the adults involved are always wrong.
Unless, of course, they do like Kevin Jennings and facilitate and cover up the teen’s promiscuous behavior.
And how’s that working out, AJ? How are things in liberal enclaves like New York, where gay and lesbian teenagers are praised and promoted by liberals like yourself and told to go out, enjoy themselves and do whatever they want?
HIV infection among New York City teens has risen to its highest level since 2001, a new data analysis shows.
The number of young people ages 13 to 19 infected with the AIDS virus rose 29% between 2004 and 2006, despite efforts to curb the spread.
And parents should just shut up and get out of the way, because they’re all bigots and liberal gays like you know better. That’s why you support covering up for gay and lesbian teenagers, right?
Back when Jennings first came up, AJ,you were insistent that there was nothing wrong with Jennings’s facilitation and support of a gay teenager going to a bus station restroom on school nights to have bareback sex with multiple partners without notifying parents or authorities was right. At that point, I challenged you to reconcile your own argument that you wouldn’t let your own kid do it with your support of Jennings hiding it from this kid’s parents and authorities.
You never answered.
And you can’t. That’s because you would have to acknowledge that Jennings’s behavior was wrong or that you were lying.
We’ve seen that liberal bigot gays like yourself are perfectly fine with exploitation of children, AJ, and believe that this should be hidden from parents and other adults. That’s why no one here is buying that you care about teenagers as anything other than political bargaining chips, martyred bodies, and sexual objects.
I asked one of the parents (who was a family friend) if something was wrong. He said, “You’re doing a good job, but I just can’t risk having someone living your kind of lifestyle around my kids.”
No surprise.
After all, gays and lesbians dress toddlers as sexual slaves, take them to sex fairs to “show off” and pleasure naked and masturbating adults, and claim the whole thing is an “educational experience”.
Or they brag about how “proud” they are that their four-year-old “daughter” is “fascinated by penises” and how she likes to look at them and touch them — especially on people whose goal is to, quote, “disarm the prudish people — make them move away or cure them of their neuroses”.
And let’s not forget how gays and lesbians get away with outright child molestation — by screaming “homophobe” and intimidating anyone who would dare investigate or criticize their doing so.
So yes, if you’re a parent with kids, why WOULD you risk that happening to them?
Are you upset? Good. Grow some balls and go after the gay-sex liberal community and its leadership that use their sexual orientation to justify these behaviors. All you’re doing now is whining that parents are mean to judge you by what the leaders of the gay and lesbian community are endorsing as normal and typical gay and lesbian behavior.
Right on cue to label all gays as disease ridden pedophiles. Gotta love the reception liberal gays get in this conservative gay blog comment thread. Kinda makes this post look ironic.
And NDT, to answer your question, just because I believe something would be wrong for my kids doesn’t mean I necessarily feel obligated to impose my views on someone else’s child, not a deep concept. And i wasnt trying to say he wasn’t wrong, only that he didn’t break the law. Big difference.
It’s not whining, it’s reiterating that liberal gay “tolerance” and “equality” is pure bullshit. It’s exposing the lie for what it is.
Sure you can. That’s what ENDA’s all about.
What’s it called when rich liberals don’t want their kids going to school with poor, often black, kids?
Or Hispanic kids, TGC. I have hippie-liberal relatives who moved into a mixed neighborhood a few years ago, yet still drive their kids 5 miles every day to the all-white schools of the pretentiously hippie-liberal (but all-white) community that they used to live in. They call it “keeping the kids with their friends”. These are truly nice people, the best that left-liberalism has to offer; which makes their hypocrisy all the more representative (of liberalism) and frightening.
@North Dallas Thirty,
Nope. I’m not upset at all. If you read my post again, I was disappointed that those parents couldn’t accept me for who I am, but I cannot force them to accept me, or feel comfortable with me (as a gay man). I smiled and moved on.
But I don’t criticize liberals for “whining” or playing “victim politics”, while at the same time complaining and whining, “I’m treated much better by conservatives, than by other gay men in San Francisco” (or West Hollywood or …etc)
Who’s whining, James?
TGC,
Is James’ call for ‘political clensing’ a whine?
I have noticed that whenever conservatives point out obnoxious behavior on the part of liberals, we are always accused of “whining.”
It’s classic childish deflection, intended to spare the liberal having to refute or defend his behavior. “I may be an obnoxious hypocrite, but you’re a whiner for pointing it out. Neener. Neener. Neender.”
I have noticed that whenever conservatives point out obnoxious behavior on the part of liberals, we are always accused of “whining.”
It’s classic childish deflection, intended to spare the liberal having to refute or defend his behavior. “I may be an obnoxious hypocrite, but you’re a whiner for pointing it out. Neener. Neener. Neener.”
If these rich liberals don’t want their kids going to these schools because they don’t want them around blacks, or Hispanics, then it’s called racism. If they want their kids going to a better, private school, so they can receive a better education, then I believe that is the Democratic principle of voting with your feet. Similar to the effects of a school voucher system a growing number of school districts practice and both sides of the aisle have embraced at times.
But I guess conservatives stopping an entire school district from continuing a long time policy to promote economic and racial integration in the school system is perfectly fine. Wouldn’t want to “socially engineer” these kids.
I love how instead of answering my question, you just quip that “liberals do it too!” as if that makes everything ok, or disproves my point. The post was about conservative gays acceptance in liberal circles and it’s quite obvious that gays have a tough, probably a tougher, time in conservative areas. That’s what my post was showing, and saying liberals do it to does nothing to refute that, good argument.
Of course AJ’s fact free rant doesn’t point out that apparently the President doesn’t want ‘those kids’ to go to school with his, and even took steps to prevent that.
Funny how the Chicago Public Schools weren’t good enough for Obama’s kids, but he picked the chief of those same schools for his SecEd.
Um maybe that’s cuz private schools tend to be better than public ones. Funny how you change topics completely instead of addressing the point of the thread. Guess when faced with disgusting acts of conservative intolerance against the gays, its best to deflect and go into a rant on the flawed public school system. Makes perfect sense.
Again, AJ shows his complete inability to deal with the concept that threads tend to drift off topic after a couple dozen comments. Some people don’t cope with change well.
Funny, my “fact free rant” had more actual facts and evidence of intolerance than all the conservative anecdotes presented in this thread. But I guess if a conservative said it happened, it must be true.
Wanting your kids to go to a school with better teacher’s doesn’t seem to be such a ridiculous thing. But I guess in your world, somehow sending your kids to a better school to get a better education amounts to being just as intolerant as not wanting your kids around other kids simply because they’re gay. Don’t want your town being known as gay friendly, that’d be awful! Gotta love that conservative tolerance.
Oh, I completely understand that threads drift off topic. Was just hoping you would want to address the topic as well at some point. If you don’t that’s fine, no biggie.
I just find it funny how people here can so easily assert, based on anecdotal evidence, that it’s easier to be a gay amongst conservatives than it is to be conservative amongst gays, when so many facts point to the opposite.
Talk about what you want, you have free speech. It’s just telling that you choose to address everything but the actual argument I laid out.
@32 James tells us:
He then goes on to tell us that he was shunned from doing a wonderful job of tutoring because he is gay.
Every tale can be told differently from other perspectives, but I sincerely hope that James is not trying tell us that his experience represents 80% of Orange County.
Frankly, I smell a rat. This tale fits the purposes of the stereotype of conservative homophobia a bit too snugly. It paints a picture of conservative busybodies phoning each other and barricading themselves from contact with the unclean caste.
Yeah, whenever a lib provides an anecdote that fits The Narrative to a T, my BS detector redlines. Also, a lot of liberals get stuck in a sort of 1974 mindset and don’t recognize that the world has moved on. It’s a point of view reinforced within the gay
ghetto; that the big bad red state world outside is a scary place and they best stay among their own kind, yessirree.The red state world described by urban liberals bears no resemblance to the one some of us have lived or spent time in during the last twenty years or so.
I can not speak to this, but I will add this thought:
Furthermore,
Eisenhower was a lightweight, Nixon was an ideologue, Reagan was an amiable dunce, Bush Sr. was totally out of touch, G.W. Bush was a bumbling, stumbling, idiot. Sarah Palin …. Oh! Please…..
Wanting your kids to go to a school with better teacher’s doesn’t seem to be such a ridiculous thing.
Unless, of course, it goes against “a long time policy to promote economic and racial integration in the school system”, at which point AJ says you’re an evil classist and racist who should be stopped from doing so.
And also, if your child is leaving on a school night from the boarding school that is supposed to be supervising them and going unaccompanied to a major metropolitan area to have bareback sex with multiple strangers in a bus station restroom, you have no right as a parent to know about that; if you object, you’re an intolerant bigot, according to AJ and his Kevin Jennings, who cover up what your child is doing because they know better than you do.
But I guess in your world, somehow sending your kids to a better school to get a better education amounts to being just as intolerant as not wanting your kids around other kids simply because they’re gay.
Except, as we see, liberals don’t care about a better education; they care only about race, skin color, and parental income in making school assignment decisions.
Furthermore, realize that AJ and his gay and lesbian ilk scream “homophobe” and “intolerant” when gays and lesbians who abuse children are scrutinized and insist that anyone who doesn’t support their taking children dressed as sexual slaves to a sex fair is “close-minded” and intolerant.
And frankly, I don’t know why any concerned parent would want their child to associate with people who dress toddlers as sex slaves for their sexual pleasure, rape and molest children, have promiscuous disease-spreading sex, openly talk about how common it is for gays and lesbians to have sex with children seventeen years their junior — and scream “homophobe” and “intolerant” when any of these behaviors are challenged.
We’re perhaps asking too much for those like AJ who support having bareback sex with unaccompanied minors in bus station restrooms to understand the perspective of actual, caring parents. AJ has already expressed his support for gay and lesbian teachers hiding sexual affairs from parents because clearly, unless parents do whatever their promiscuous teenagers want, they’re incompetent, hateful, and bigoted.
Says the asshole who chose not to answer my question.
http://tinyurl.com/4rr2aj7
Well it does if you’re a democrat. Ask the parents of the kids trapped in DC schools.
No, the argument is valid. I was just pointing out the hypocrisy of calling the left’s argument invalid because they’re calling for civil discourse later than you would’ve liked. Both arguments are valid, at some point things need to change.
Though I guess asking for you to address liberals civilly is pointless. Once again proving this post to be silly. Seems this supposed liberal hatred of conservative gays is dwarfed by the conservative intolerance of liberal gays, as evidenced numerous times in this thread post alone.
Love the continued misdirection. I guess no one want’s to point out how conservative parents not wanting their kids to be around gay children somehow doesn’t amount to intolerance.
Or maybe it’s just that these lovely, tolerant conservative gays here pretty much agree that conservative parents’ children shouldn’t have to endure the presence of gay children? Who knows, no one seems to actually want to address that point. I’d be curious to hear.
“What was I supposed to do at that point? Should I have gotten frustrated & angry and told those parents to judge me for my own actions & character, rather than their disapproval of homosexuality in general?”
Minus the “frustrated and angry”, that would have been an **excellent** response. I would have written a polite letter saying that, yes, I was gay, but that that had no bearing on my ability to teach these kids, and sent it to each of my clients (and former clients). Respect, a smile, and an open hand can accomplish a surprising amount.
Indeed. Everybody else is intolerant except the intolerant bigots that make up the liberal left.
I guess no one want’s to point out how conservative parents not wanting their kids to be around gay children somehow doesn’t amount to intolerance.
Actually, it’s been pointed out to you several times, but perhaps this time it will stick.
Why should parents want their children to be around people who insist on breaking school rules, sneaking off to major metropolitan areas unaccompanied, and having bareback sex with multiple strangers in a public restroom — all with the full support and connivance of other gays and lesbians who deliberately block this information from their parents?
Why should parents want their children to associate with people who dress up toddlers as sexual slaves and then take them to “show off” in front of naked and masturbating adults, insisting that doing so is an “educational experience” and that anyone who disagrees is intolerant and “close-minded”?
And why should parents want their children to associate with people who brag about how having sex with children seventeen years their junior is “common” and completely normal?
Really, AJ, when you have gays and lesbians screaming that people who investigate complaints of child molestation are “homophobic”, pretty much everyone has realized at this point that “intolerant’ and “homophobic” means not giving you your way.
AJ, perhaps we just need you to state this for the record.
Please state that you have absolutely no problem with your teenager associating with people who routinely break curfew, go to major metropolitan areas unsupervised, have bareback sex with multiple adults in bus station restrooms, and then get a compliant adult to cover it up so they don’t have to tell their parents.
And remember, if you do have a problem with that or with your teenager associating with people who do that, you’re bigoted and intolerant.
Are you going to actually make an argument or just rail against the left and call me names? I don’t know why you keep attacking my posts without actually saying anything. You haven’t once formed a counter argument against what I said. I’m hoping you can maybe stop the pettiness and have an actual debate. But if you don’t want to, that’s fine too. Though it would be nice to actually discuss the blog post related to this comment thread.
NDT, You’re taking a few examples of extremely irresponsible gay individuals and extrapolating that to brand the whole gay population as extremely irresponsible. If you don’t see logical fallacy with your argument, then I can’t help you.
NDT, You’re taking a few examples of extremely irresponsible gay individuals and extrapolating that to brand the whole gay population as extremely irresponsible.
Correction. I am taking examples and using them to illustrate the fact that gays and lesbians like yourself support and endorse the people like Kevin Jennings who carry out such “extremely irresponsible” behavior.
Add to that this bit of hypocrisy:
And NDT, to answer your question, just because I believe something would be wrong for my kids doesn’t mean I necessarily feel obligated to impose my views on someone else’s child, not a deep concept.
when you’ve been demanding that you be allowed to impose your pro-promiscuity and irresponsibility views on other people’s children, and what we see very quickly is the usual “rules for thee, but not for me” attitude of the gay and lesbian left.
“Our experience has shown, it’s far easier to be openly gay in conservative circles than it is to be openly conservative in gay circles.”
That’s because gay is something you are. Conservative is something you decide to become.
Homosexuality isn’t evil, it’s a state of being, which is why it’s inappropriate to castigate someone for being gay.
Political conservatism represents, instead, a constant series of decisions. If you choose to be a dickhead about immigrants, religious minorities or the poor, it’s perfectly acceptable to criticize you for that choice.
You mean that I should just shut up and agree with your diversion from the topic?
Hmmm. You did, essentially, the same damn thing when you ventured off onto your gay victimhood rant. What’s the motivation for addressing you “civilly”, again?
Will you sue us, like McMillen, to force us to like you, agree with you and give you what you want?
I dk, maybe just basic human decency would compel you to address others civilly. It’s your choice, I don’t really care, just a suggestion. I never saw the reason for using obscenities when debating. If you need to resort to that, usually means you don’t have much of substance to say. And last time I checked, Judeo-Christian principles don’t say you should simply treat only the people you agree with respectfully. But I could be wrong.
I never said all conservatives were intolerant towards gays. I don’t know all conservatives and I would imagine that very very many of them would have no problem. I have many conservative friends who have no problem with it. NDT, however used a few examples to suggest that the vast majority of liberal gays are disease ridden pedophiles. There is definitely a difference in the arguments.
And my post on “gay vitcimhood” wasn’t a distraction. This blog post is about “gay victimhood”. This post was about gays not being tolerated in liberal areas, San Fran, and my so called “distraction” was about gays not being tolerated in conservative areas. Seems on topic to me. Is it that hard to see the connection?
Ah yes. AJ accuses me of distracting from the topic by pointing out that the President doesn’t want ‘those kids’ to go to school with his own.
of course, as AE pointed out, and AJ ducked, he’d prefer to compare a private community *gasp* enforcing their rules and say that it’s equal to assaulting people who disagree with them.
Talk about changing the subject…
You don’t strike me as a decent human. For example:
A standard amongst smug, arrogant jackasses who can’t cope with the fact that not everybody thinks they’re just as wonderful.
Keep backpedaling.
AE made a valid point about the shelter, obviously they can make their own rules, even if they are intolerant towards gays, which was my point anyways. I never said that intolerance didn’t exist on the left though.
But neither him, nor anyone else seems to want to address the intolerance on the right though, as if it’s non existent. I was just showing that it might not be as easy to be openly gay in conservative circles as this post suggests. No one wants to seem to address that.
How is that backpedaling? What is this post about then?
Holy, we’re not talking about disagreement, but about outright intolerance and nastiness.
I gotcha, but how is actively working to keep your children away from other children simply because they are gay tolerant? I mean isn’t that the definition of intolerance?
That’s because gay is something you are. Conservative is something you decide to become.
Tell that to “Bishop” Gene Robinson and Jim McGreevey, both of whom decided to become gay after inexplicably marrying, fathering children, and deciding that they were bored and didn’t care about their wives or the promises they’d made.
And furthermore, if you’re trying to argue that society has to accept you because you “are”, will you be arguing for the abolishment of laws against pedophilia, since research shows it has a strong biological component and requires you to suppress your sexual instincts in order to avoid it?
I have to reject the premise that there is a widespread phenomenon of parents telling their kids to shun other gay kids. There may be isolated cases, just as there are isolated cases of feminist lesbian separatist who shun all contact with males. But I don’t know of it as something that exists much outside the paranoid minds of certain gays.
(And I assume by “kids” we’re meaning teenagers here, because the notion of labeling prepubescent children is sick and perverse.)
I gotcha, but how is actively working to keep your children away from other children simply because they are gay tolerant?
Again: WHY would any parent want their child to associate with people who break school rules, travel unaccompanied to major metropolitan areas, have bareback sex with multiple strangers in bus station restrooms, and then collude with other gay and lesbian people to cover it up and hide it from their parents?
You yourself pretended to say that you wouldn’t let your own child do it. Why in the bloody hell would you then let your child associate with people who do it and support doing it?
Answer: Because you put gay and lesbian promiscuity ahead of childrens’ welfare. Just like you put racial and economic quotas ahead of childrens’ education. You could care less about how well children are being educated as long as you have the “correct” percentage of races in the school and the curriculum is properly indoctrinating them that dressing children up as sexual slaves is normal behavior.
Well that’s fine. It wasn’t my premise anyways. I’d say pretty much the same thing about gay conservatives being treated with intolerance and nastiness. I have never seen a gay conservative in a social setting have nastiness directed their way because of political beliefs. Disagreement? sure. But this notion that gay conservatives are often harassed or run out of bars because they voted for Bush, or some other conservative, seems ridiculous. Not that it matters to the discussion at all, but the last two guys I dated voted for Bush, never heard a nasty thing directed towards them because of their politics.
Gay culture’s highest value is self-gratification. The highest value of Christianity is personal sacrifice. Naturally, the two philosophies are irreconciliable.
Oh my. I have a lot of liberal friends, none of whom support any child engaging in risky sex. It seems like a very broad brush you’re painting with. When you say it’s OK to keep your kids away from gay kids because they’re promiscuous, does that mean you yourself are having seedy, bareback sex because it’s a necessary part of being gay? Must kids wait until they’re older to admit they find men attractive?
Of course Republicans are more welcoming of gay conservatives, than gays are of conservatives in general.
The right wing closet cases know homocons will give them blowjobs in public toilets.
When you say it’s OK to keep your kids away from gay kids because they’re promiscuous, does that mean you yourself are having seedy, bareback sex because it’s a necessary part of being gay?
Actually, Pooch, the vast majority of liberal gays and lesbians with whom I interact have proclaimed that I am “not gay” because I a) don’t support bareback sex and promiscuity for teenagers and b) I criticize people who do.
And as for Mr. Enemabag Jones, the reality is that liberal gays and lesbians like yourself are child rapists, who not only solicit, but actually sell, children for sex online and adopt children for the purpose of molesting them.
Now watch. The leftist screaming gays will start whining about “civility”. That’s what happens when the little bullies get called out and treated like they treat others; they go running off to mommy’s skirts.
When liberal gays and lesbians repudiate the words of Enemabag, then I will retract my statement. Otherwise, I see no reason to treat liberal gays and lesbians with civility or decency because, as Enemabag shows, they clearly understand and practice neither.
Gay culture’s highest value is self-gratification. The highest value of Christianity is personal sacrifice. Naturally, the two philosophies are irreconciliable.
How much barebacking did you do, James before you decided to climb up on your cross?
The Republican party is the party of drug addled junkies, child molesters, wife beaters, rapists, and money launderers.
Not to mention closet cases who sexually assault their straight roommates while they’re sleeping, and use church donations to hire rent boys, and pay teenage boys for sexual favours.
Nothing brings me more pleasure than thoroughly eviscerating some pathetic homocon as they try desperately to defend the indefensible.
the vast majority of liberal gays and lesbians with whom I interact have proclaimed that I am “not gay”
You mean the vast majority of the voices in your head, Jeff. No one plays the victim card better than a homocon.
As far as accusations of child abuse, Jeff, let’s see what Republicans are up to:
Republican aide, Alan David Berlin, was arrested on charges that he wanted to engage in sex acts with a 15 year old boy while dressed in a panda costume.
Republican activist and former presidential campaign chairman Jeffrey Claude Bartleson was arrested on charges of sexually molesting a 5-year old boy.
Republican activist and former chairman of the Christian County Republicans Royce Fessenden pleaded guilty to two counts of first-degree child molestation and one count of second-degree statutory sodomy.
And that’s just the tip of the iceberg. And that is the party you are a member of and support, By defending their actions, you are complicit in their actions, Jeff.
I stand by my assertion that the Republican party is the party of degenerates. Which is why they are so welcoming to the human refuse that infects American political dialogue.
Any time a half way decent homocon comes along, like Dan, he is usually drowned out by the cackles of the screeching harpies like NDT, V the K, and GP himself, Bruce.
Leave the conservatives, Dan! Come to the dark side, we have cookies! Fabulous cookies, made from a recipe found in the back of The Gay Agenda!
But you’ll have to leave your pro Prop 8 BS behind. Either that, or actually get a boyfriend, therefore giving you a legitimate platform to actually discuss relationships.
I wonder if Auntie Dogma can understand my feelings when my son’s new roommate unloaded on me over my conservative views?
I should know, I was very welcoming to a gay couple that moved next door, had them over to the house a number of times, tried to be open and friendly – but my politics got in their way – not my actions.
Unless you two were wearing a giant picture of George Bush around your necks like a Flavor Flav clock, I doubt your friends and nieghbours knew about your political convictions.
Chances are, like most right wingers, you felt it necessary to open your mouths and say something absurd. Most like regarding American LGBTQ’s.
To any straight allies reading this please understand, it’s lovely that you play at accepting us and wanting to be our friends. But when you side that friendship with a belief that it’s the governments job to keep a certain segment of society unequal, through laws that only effect a certain segment of society, and you wholeheartedly support a party who works at creating a two tier system for Americans, you need to realize that our rejection of your friendship comes from a feeling of being turned against, not just because you espouse right wing ideals.
That goes for Republicans and Democrats.
Actually, Mr. Enemabag, given that you clearly support and endorse rape and child molestation, all your screaming and whining about “Republicans” is doing is demonstrating that, not only do you sexually exploit children, you act as a hypocrite about it.
Furthermore, given how you support and endorse Eric Massa, a true elected leader of the Obama Party, it should be obvious to anyone that you really are a complete and total hypocrite.
And the reason you are treated as a second-class citizen is because you are one, Enemabag. You have a mental and physical disorder that causes you to want to rape and molest children, that makes you an antireligious bigot, that causes you to sexually harass coworkers, and which spurs you to violent acts and rhetoric such as calling for Sarah Palin’s rape and murder.
You are not equal. You are in fact mentally and physically disturbed. Your sexual orientation keeps you from functioning normally in society. Your argument makes no more sense than if Jared Loughner were to argue that he should be treated “equally”.
You are not equal. You are in fact mentally and physically disturbed. Your sexual orientation keeps you from functioning normally in society.
Really? Aren’t you the person who went to the Folsom Street Fair wearing a leather kilt, and a body harness, Jeff? The FSF, where adults perform sexual acts in public, while kids are walking around?
Did you tell the parents of those kids to take them home, Jeff? Or did those kids being present while you were parading around in your leather gear give you a thrill?
You’re a goddamned degenerate, Jeff. No wonder you’re a member of the Republican party.
That’s pathetic and sad, because I can think of at 50,000 things that bring me more pleasure than vivesecting idiot liberals.
Oh look, a new troll, and the same old tired discredited arguments.
Even in the examples he tries to give, he misses the point. Conservatives do police their own. Liberals elevate the worst of their type.
That’s pathetic and sad, because I can think of at 50,000 things that bring me more pleasure than vivesecting idiot liberals.
Clearly, spelling correctly isn’t one of those things. It’s vivisecting. And you call yourself a writer.
Conservatives do police their own.
Whose trolling now?
Really? Aren’t you the person who went to the Folsom Street Fair wearing a leather kilt, and a body harness, Jeff?
Yup, for one year. Raised a ton of money doing it, too — all of which I had the experience of seeing essentially fly out the window. Nothing like standing there working your butt off to help people with HIV who can’t pay their bills — only to see people who you know are HIV-positive having disease-spreading sex in public.
That was when I realized something about gay liberals like yourself, Enemabag. For all your whining about how “victimized” and “oppressed” you are, all that you do is create more victims and oppress more people. You complain and complain and complain about how awful HIV is, and then you just go and spread it right to the next person.
That’s why, based on what I saw, I’ve spent the years since condemning the irresponsible and promiscuous behavior that happens there, and especially those who bring children into that space.
You, on the other hand, are one of the people who has been screaming at and criticizing me for calling out the people who bring children to that event and engage in irresponsible behavior there, insisting that my criticizing it makes me “self-loathing”.
You fully support bareback sex, promiscuity, and sexual exploitation of children. And that means society should treat you as such — a second-class, diseased, and damaged individual.
Yup, for one year. Raised a ton of money doing it, too — all of which I had the experience of seeing essentially fly out the window. Nothing like standing there working your butt off to help people with HIV who can’t pay their bills — only to see people who you know are HIV-positive having disease-spreading sex in public.
You can try and defend your perverse activities all you want, Jeff. But that doesn’t change the fact that you were there, participating.
You didn’t walk away in protest. You stayed and I’m sure had a blast, while adults were getting off in every conceivable manner. You’re the reason why right wingers don’t believe we deserve to be parents.
Because of people like you, James had to fight his ass off in court to get his kids.
You went a public sex show, dressed in your leather drag. I am fairly certain that no one else on this board, liberal, or conservative, straight, or gay, did that.
You are representative of what is wrong with the Republican party–accepting every freak, pervert and degenerate that America has.
No wonder the Tea Party was formed. Who would want to belong to an organization that would have the likes of you?
Haha, watching NDT get a taste of his own medicine is kind of fun. Watching two people fight with completely illogical arguments is pretty amusing.
Because of people like you, James had to fight his ass off in court to get his kids.
Oh, are you now coming around to that? Well, then, it would make sense for you to do like I have, repudiate people who sexually exploit and molest children, and stop going to these sex fairs, right?
That’s the difference, Enemabag. If you truly believe what you just wrote, why do you and yours continue to promote and endorse child sexual exploitation and molestation?
The answer is that you don’t; you’re just using the usual leftist tactics of trying to deflect from your own hypocrisy by accusing others. It is hilarious to watch an unrepentant child molester and disease-spreader like you scream and whine and try to condemn other peoples’ behavior when you yourself are still practicing, supporting, and endorsing the same behavior.
This is what makes gays and lesbians like AJ such transparently-obvious liars. AJ, for example, pretends he opposes children having bareback sex with strangers in public restrooms and hiding it from their parents, but then supports and endorses gays and lesbians who do exactly that and defends gays and lesbians who cover up such behavior like Kevin Jennings.
And before you whine, AJ, prepare to have Enemabag’s argument thrown right back at you. According to Enemabag, doing something once, regardless of whether you later state it was a bad idea or not, marks you for life. So by Enemabag’s logic, you must state that Kevin Jennings is permanently tainted and never should be trusted with children again because of that one instance, regardless of whether he says he was right or wrong.
You are representative of what is wrong with the Republican party–accepting every freak, pervert and degenerate that America has.
No wonder the Tea Party was formed. Who would want to belong to an organization that would have the likes of you?
Funny, Nancy Pelosi babbled that it was perfectly acceptable.
So I guess that means that Obama Party and Pelosi supporters like yourself are perverts, freaks, and degenerates.
Which was what we originally started with in the first place.
And meanwhile, let’s put the death to another of your attempts to lie.
Any time a half way decent homocon comes along, like Dan, he is usually drowned out by the cackles of the screeching harpies like NDT, V the K, and GP himself, Bruce.
Which is, of course, why you and your fellow liberal gays and lesbians fully supported this characterization of Dan Blatt.
I think that’s an excellent representation of what liberal gays and lesbians and their Obama Party masters think constitutes “civility” and “respect”.
And that is why people treat you as a second-class citizen, Enemabag; anyone who would support or write that kind of stuff is obviously a very damaged and irrational individual, and since their sexual orientation clearly causes them to act that way, it makes perfect sense to treat them in that fashion.
NDT, I’d LOVE for you to show me a quote and link where I supported or endorsed bareback sex in a bus stop with children or supported people who engaged in such disgusting acts. Pretty please? With sugar on top?
Oh wait, you can’t cuz you’re lying. It’s just getting outta control now. Can’t wait to see what you make up next!
What’s with this attitude, that all social conservatives hate gays? Younger generations tend not too, and my generation least of all. Not to mention, plenty of conservative subcultures aren’t socially conservative.
It’s a diverse country out there. Oh and lefties: I do prefer living with those against gay marriage over people like you. Think about that for a while. Groupthinking is far, far more oppressive then homophobia; at least homophobes are *honest* about their discrimination.
If someone says all conservatives hate gays they’re just being ignorant. My friends, conservative or liberal, have all been fine with me coming out. Generational differences definitely play a role in it.
And I agree with you on the group think thing. I love hanging out with liberals, but some of my best conversations are with gay conservatives. If you dont seek out differing opinions then your line of thinking will never evolve.