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Kirk Cameron in Context

Posted by B. Daniel Blatt at 3:52 am - March 13, 2012.
Filed under: Gays / Homosexuality (general),Movies/Film & TV

Perhaps, it’s because Kirk Cameron is not an elected official that I didn’t make much of his comments earlier this month, calling homosexuality “unnatural“, even, as he put it, “detrimental and ultimately destructive to so many of the foundations of civilization.”  He has a right to his opinions. And we have a right to challenge him on them.

The fact that so many have raised such a ruckus over his remarks shows how far we’ve come since he was at the peak of his celebrity.  His hit TV series Growing Pains ended its run in 1992, five years before Ellen DeGeneres’s coming out made the cover of Time magazine.  Today, homosexuality has become so mainstream that we barely bat an eyelid when a celebrity comes out.

Had he made offered similar comments at that time, his notions would have generated far less controversy.

Not just that, most of us are secure enough in our sexuality that we don’t feel threatened by a one-time teen hearth throb’s contrary opinions.

Something else to bear in mind:  the night Mr. Cameron offered his opinions on homosexuality, fewer than half a million Americans tuned into Mr. Morgan’s show.  More than twice that number were watching the openly lesbian Rachel Maddow on MSNBC.  Ellen De Generes’s daytime talk show draws nearly three million viewers.

And that’s the real change.  These “out” lesbians anchor television programs and continue to flourish in the open market.  So, let Mr. Cameron speak his mind; his opinions won’t undo the social changes of the past twenty years.



  1. Kirk is such a hottie, but he is entitled to his opinion, even though I disagree with it.

    I remember watching the show Growing Pains, and one year, Kirk is a goofball and troublemaker, and the next year, he is a goodie goodie. That is because during the summer break, he found Jesus and wouldn’t do anything on the show that would be impure. No shirtless shots, no being the bad boy.

    Comment by davinci — March 13, 2012 @ 7:25 pm - March 13, 2012

  2. Thanks for the reply, Sandhorse.

    the term ‘victim mentality’ gets used so indiscriminately against the gay community as to be nearly devoid of all meaning.

    Maybe it does get over-used, but it isn’t devoid of meaning. I am not trying to say the entire gay population is this way, but many gay people seem to claim to be “second class citizens” quite frequently (among other things). The only reason someone, in the United States or anywhere else in the West, would be a second class citizen is if they made themselves one. But they claim to be the victim of conservatives, or Christians, or heterosexuals, or whoever (or whatever) causes their second-class citizen status.

    Which, to me, implies it is being used more as a means of instilling a feeling of superiority over said group.

    Perhaps. I believe I am superior, in a way, to people who are reckless and who needlessly endager their lives by having unprotected sex and by using drugs (for example). However, that belief is inconsequential as the measurement of my success will ultimately determine my superiority or inferiority (in a way).

    If one truly believes any person or group has such a low self image, what purpose does it serve to point it out in such a fashion?

    It is not low self-image; it is the feeling of (unjustified) entitlement, which can be pernicious.

    Comment by Rattlesnake — March 13, 2012 @ 7:30 pm - March 13, 2012

  3. Please stop, titillating each other and realize that the large intestine didn’t evolve for the purpose of “poking” the prostate. Start really caring about each other and do your best to find other ways to find fulfillment. I don’t want to see any of you “disappear” as so many have already.

    Comment by Richard Bell — March 13, 2012 @ 7:35 pm - March 13, 2012

  4. To clarify the final statement I made in my previous comment, a feeling of entitlement that is caused by an unjustified feeling of victimhood (that is, whoever possesses the feeling of victimhood feels as though they are entitled to reparations for being subjected to that which they are a victom of (or something)) can be pernicious (from my perspective), especially when that feeling is combined with sympathetic people in power. And to be clear, I am not suggesting that my morality be enforced upon anyone, but I would not like to be subjected to (or enforced to comply with) beliefs that I believe are perverse (which is the effect of such entitlement/victimhood, such as with hate speech laws).

    Comment by Rattlesnake — March 13, 2012 @ 7:39 pm - March 13, 2012

  5. 53.Please stop, titillating each other and realize that the large intestine didn’t evolve for the purpose of “poking” the prostate.

    I’ll have to tell my urologist that next time I have an appt. with her so she can “find other ways” to check my prostate. 🙂

    Comment by Pat — March 13, 2012 @ 7:43 pm - March 13, 2012

  6. #55 – Pat- Okay, I’ll grin along with you for the moment, knowing you realize there is a difference between a check-up and not a check-up.

    Comment by Richard Bell — March 13, 2012 @ 8:01 pm - March 13, 2012

  7. Thanks in return for your reply, Rattle. I understand your point of view. Though I still stand by my statement that ‘victim mentality’ is use far too cavalierly. Perhaps some other time we can discuss the terms ‘second class citizen’ and the ‘entitlement’ mentality to which you refer. I enjoy thoughtful discussions but detest having to sit in front of a computer to have them.

    Comment by Sandhorse — March 13, 2012 @ 8:29 pm - March 13, 2012

  8. SF >> Michael Medved will spoil plot twists if he doesn’t agree with the politics behind the story.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — March 13, 2012 @ 8:29 pm - March 13, 2012

  9. Sandhorse, ever skype. I have friends who love it. Tis a good way for many of my friends in rural Mt although bandwith can be troublesome.

    Comment by rusty — March 13, 2012 @ 8:38 pm - March 13, 2012

  10. Interesting suggestion Rusty. I’ll have to consider that. I have a system set up in my living room that would be ideal. Though I don’t know how my other half would feel about me menopolizing the room for that. 😉

    Comment by Sandhorse — March 13, 2012 @ 9:02 pm - March 13, 2012

  11. Just pointing out, “second class citizen” isn’t my word.

    Comment by Rattlesnake — March 13, 2012 @ 9:24 pm - March 13, 2012

  12. Sorry, it’s a phrase, not a word. It isn’t my phrase.

    Comment by Rattlesnake — March 13, 2012 @ 9:25 pm - March 13, 2012

  13. And he really hates movies with snow ninjas in it!

    Comment by sonicfrog — March 13, 2012 @ 10:39 pm - March 13, 2012

  14. I cannot find any animal species that places extremities into vaginal and anal orifices, let alone multiple extremities.

    rjligier, it’s hard to parse that comment, but the charitable interpretation would be that you cannot find an animal species which has anything but male-female, penis-vagina sexual contact. Assuming that’s what you meant… well, you also won’t find any animal species that uses machines to fly. BUT, leaving that aside, and just focusing on the sexual behavior of other species… Amazon has a book for you, that you may want to read before you try to make that kind of comment again:

    To be clear: Yes, homosexuality definitely exists elsewhere in the animal kingdom. Lots of it. In that sense, homosexuality is quite natural. If you’re against it, you’d be better off making an ethical argument (like, “well fighting is natural too and we don’t want that…”).

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — March 13, 2012 @ 10:48 pm - March 13, 2012

  15. Fantabulous ILC

    Homosexuality in its myriad forms has been scientifically documented in more than 450 species of mammals, birds, reptiles, insects, and other animals worldwide. Biological Exuberance is the first comprehensive account of the subject, bringing together accurate, accessible, and nonsensationalized information. Drawing upon a rich body of zoological research spanning more than two centuries, Bruce Bagemihl shows that animals engage in all types of nonreproductive sexual behavior. Sexual and gender expression in the animal world displays exuberant variety, including same-sex courtship, pair-bonding, sex, and co-parenting—even instances of lifelong homosexual bonding in species that do not have lifelong heterosexual bonding.

    Comment by rusty — March 13, 2012 @ 11:18 pm - March 13, 2012

  16. I hate that annual prostate exam. I walk around gingerly for a few minutes.

    Comment by davinci — March 13, 2012 @ 11:30 pm - March 13, 2012

  17. Lorigirl Started with: I always cringe when people make public statements like Cameron did.

    davinci latest statement: I walk around gingerly for a few minutes.

    Funny thread

    Comment by rusty — March 13, 2012 @ 11:46 pm - March 13, 2012


    Comment by Bruce (GayPatriot) — March 14, 2012 @ 12:18 am - March 14, 2012

  19. Let me just say that, IMHO, the term ‘victim mentality’ gets used so indiscriminately against the gay community as to be nearly devoid of all meaning. Which, to me, implies it is being used more as a means of instilling a feeling of superiority over said group.

    And let me say that I do have a “feeling of superiority over said group” just as much as any person who finds it pathetic when abused people keep running back to the abuser “because he said he loves me!” has. Hell yes. What’s more, I’m happy and secure in myself. I don’t need a politico or a slutty parade once a year to make me feel good about myself. Don’t need to surround myself with people telling me how wonderful I am either.

    Miserable slobs repeating the same “Jewish Nazi” agitprop, insisting that others kill themselves or that their parents really don’t love them is…..what in your book?

    Comment by TGC — March 14, 2012 @ 1:04 am - March 14, 2012

  20. I would just point out that lots of things humans find abhorrent… cannibalism, rape, incest… are also common in the animal kingdom. The point of being human is that we’re supposed to be better than animals.

    Comment by V the K — March 14, 2012 @ 6:15 am - March 14, 2012

  21. @70

    Amen. Thus my comment about ‘beating up the weak and taking their stuff’ 🙂

    The tangent about ‘victim mentality’ caught my eye. I’m fond of pulling out my sinister card when it gets to arguments of oppression. Usually it annoys the ‘professional victims’ because it uses the exact same arguments. Over on the Paizo boards, there’s often commentary on how there’s no (openly) gay Iconic character (we’ve been told at least one plays for the other team). I usually reply with some rift of “but why is there no openly left handed character? How can young lefties feel included in Pathfinder when there’s no left handed character for them to look up to?” the agrieved class always walks right into it, claiming there’s no history of persecution of lefties. When I show they’re wrong, it becomes “there’s no persecution of lefties in recent history.” Then when I show that’s wrong and I lament how society is still designed against the left handed person, they’re reduced to sputtering it’s not the same.

    It’s always great fun.

    Comment by The Livewire — March 14, 2012 @ 8:22 am - March 14, 2012


    I had the same reaction.

    Comment by Richard Bell — March 14, 2012 @ 11:00 am - March 14, 2012

  23. It’s always great fun.

    Grab me next time. Not left handed, but it oughta be a hoot to read.

    Comment by TGC — March 14, 2012 @ 7:06 pm - March 14, 2012

  24. we’re supposed to be better than animals

    Not something I would ever dispute.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — March 14, 2012 @ 9:00 pm - March 14, 2012

  25. Who compares us to animals?

    Comment by Sandhorse — March 15, 2012 @ 10:33 am - March 15, 2012

  26. At #64, I pointed out that one specific line of argument, “homosexuality is unnatural in the sense that other animals don’t do it”, is false.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — March 15, 2012 @ 12:17 pm - March 15, 2012

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