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Contemporary liberalism:
preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real?

Posted by B. Daniel Blatt at 3:18 am - July 3, 2012.
Filed under: LA Stories,Liberals,Random Thoughts

Last week, when watching TV news footage of people protesting a Walmart being built in LA’s Chinatown, I caught sight of a sign which seemed to define contemporary American liberalism, “Good Jobs/not Walmart jobs.”

Given all the empty storefronts in neighborhoods across Los Angeles, you’d wonder why people are protesting a company willing to invest its own money into a new job-creating enterprise in the Southland.  This jobs project would not require higher taxes, indeed, would increase the state’s tax base without taking money from Sacramento’s (or Washington’s) depleted treasury.

These protestors, however, prefer these abstract “good jobs” to the very real “Walmart Jobs.”  They favor, that is, something that exists in the abstract, in theory, to something very real — and well, like most real things, (at least) slightly imperfect.

Does seem that that notion, preferring the abstract, untried “better” to the flawed “good” defines contemporary liberalism — as we have seen in their various fixes (over the years) proposed for (and applied to) our health care system.

The incumbent Secretary of the Treasury (at 1:40 below) provides another illustration of this phenomenon, acknowledging that the Democratic administration doesn’t have a definitive solution to the debt problem, but, well, they just don’t like the one that Republicans have put on the table.

The Geithner/Obama solution to our nation’s debt problem exists entirely in the abstract.

Today’s liberals, it seems, like real-world solutions. Like the “good jobs” for which the anti-Walmart protestors militate, their answers exist only in the realm of theory, in the hopes of idealists.

FROM THE COMMENTS:  V the K offers a related point on Walmart and liberals:

This illustrates a big difference between liberals and conservatives. Conservatives say, “If you don’t like Wal-Mart, don’t shop there.” Liberals say, “We don’t like Wal-Mart, so no one must be allowed to shop there.”

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86 Comments

  1. Dan, Can you provide an analysis of its guaranteed success? And, if it fails, isn’t it written off anyway? So, how much of it is “its own money”? Just wondering. I have no idea.

    I’m not supporting or criticizing the protests, by the way. Their qualms could be artificial or authentic–the article quotes George Yu as suggesting the former. And his website is much more credible than Unionosity’s.

    My understanding is that this particular Walmart isn’t going to be a Walmart in the traditional sense (more of a scaled down version). I also wonder if Walmart made any effort to ingratiate itself into the community. Working from the inside tends to provide more positive results.

    I imagine that ethnic pride may play into it, would it not? Does it not have a place?

    There are many variables here which have gone unexamined.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 3:36 am - July 3, 2012

  2. Cinesnatch, providing an analysis of “guaranteed success” would be to do (as I daresay what Walmart has already done) a study based on the placement of stores in similar locales — to evaluate the local market.

    That’s a good question about whether Walmart has reached out to the community. I don’t know.

    I’m just making the point about the abstraction of the “good jobs” in that sign. Do they exist? Given the empty storefronts we see all over this town — and the County’s high unemployment rate, I would daresay that they do not.

    Comment by B. Daniel Blatt — July 3, 2012 @ 3:43 am - July 3, 2012

  3. I agree. At least Walmart is bringing something to the table. What I find ironic is that what they sell is mostly made in China.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 3:51 am - July 3, 2012

  4. I have only shopped occasionally at Walmart since moving to LA, mostly in stores outside the city (when traveling) and have found they have great bargains on toys. . . . . never checked to see where they were made.

    Comment by B. Daniel Blatt — July 3, 2012 @ 4:04 am - July 3, 2012

  5. Huh. Kind of thought that was common knowledge (without having to shop there).

    https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ie=UTF-8&ion=1#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=where+are+walmart+products+made&oq=where+are+walmart+products+made&gs_l=hp.3..0.2053.9912.1.10031.37.20.3.12.12.0.149.1909.14j6.20.0…0.0.dcR7roNj5S4&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=54147a6c24560a3&ion=1&biw=1265&bih=629

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 4:13 am - July 3, 2012

  6. What the hell do these people call a “good” job, anyway? One where they sit at a desk nine to five, lording it over those fucking redneck Jesus freaks? /sarc

    Seriously, what on Earth is wrong with these people? Work is work, surely.

    Comment by perturbed — July 3, 2012 @ 4:28 am - July 3, 2012

  7. This illustrates a big difference between liberals and conservatives. Conservatives say, “If you don’t like Wal-Mart, don’t shop there.” Liberals say, “We don’t like Wal-Mart, so no one must be allowed to shop there.”

    Comment by V the K — July 3, 2012 @ 7:40 am - July 3, 2012

  8. #6: “Liberals say, ‘We don’t like Wal-Mart, so no one must be allowed to shop there.’”

    Yes, that is what they say, but incidentally, they DO shop there and at Target and at every other big retailer they condemn for ‘exploiting workers’ and selling products manufactured in foreign countries. Liberals are shameless hypocrites but their narcissism enables them to rely on huge rationalizations whenever they want to benefit from the convenience, selection, and low prices that large retailers offer. Show me a liberal who bitterly laments ‘mom & pop’ stores being squeezed out by national corporate retailers, and I’ll show you a hypocrite whose home is stuffed to the rafters with products from Ikea, Wal-Mart, Target, Bed Bath & Beyond, & Costco.

    Comment by Sean A — July 3, 2012 @ 8:33 am - July 3, 2012

  9. Vince,

    Many years ago, Wal-Mart had a Made in America campaign as a reaction to so much manufacturing being outsourced. They were “caught” by the anti-Wal-Mart loons at having some stock that was foreign made.

    Then, they were forced just like every other retailer in the country to offer foreign made (think China) goods and they dropped the whole red, white and blue made in America campaign.

    The reality of “made in China” is beyond any retailer’s ability to fight. If you know where you can buy your underwear which is loomed and fabricated in the USA, tell Warren Buffet. He owns Fruit of the Loom and Russell and they don’t sew a single stitch in the USA.

    I wonder at those who yell about “out-sourcing” and such. Are you high protective tariff advocates? Do you want flat screen TVs that cost a fortune?

    Wal-Mart is free to succeed or fail on its own merits. Is has succeeded mightily. People flock to shop there for the variety and the prices and the quality. Why is the “Progressive” world so intent on punishing it? Just down the road is Sears, Target, K-Mart, Lowe’s, Home Depot, and a world of more local chains. It is not like Google. You have choices.

    Comment by heliotrope — July 3, 2012 @ 8:46 am - July 3, 2012

  10. To the Left, Good = Union.

    Comment by John Hart — July 3, 2012 @ 10:07 am - July 3, 2012

  11. Another difference between liberals and conservatives is that liberals turn to the government to solve every problem. If there is a shortage of jobs, the government must do something about it (and they don’t mean lower taxes, cut spending, and simplify regulations to spur economic growth). The governing Conservative Party in Canada is criticized for not having a “jobs plan,” whatever that is. This is a very dangerous mentality.

    Comment by Rattlesnake — July 3, 2012 @ 11:09 am - July 3, 2012

  12. The reality of “made in China” is beyond any retailer’s ability to fight. If you know where you can buy your underwear which is loomed and fabricated in the USA, tell Warren Buffet. He owns Fruit of the Loom and Russell and they don’t sew a single stitch in the USA.

    Wow Helio…… You almost went all “Occupy Gay Patriot” on us there for a moment!!!! :-)

    Comment by sonicfrog — July 3, 2012 @ 11:12 am - July 3, 2012

  13. America needs to move beyond manufacturing small ticket items. Isn’t it better to manufacture buses, planes, engines, locomotives, medical equipment and other high ticket items? At Walmart, you can always choose to by underwear made in Thailand, Viet Nam or India.

    Comment by TnnsNE1 — July 3, 2012 @ 11:29 am - July 3, 2012

  14. Don’t you think more stuff would be made in the USA, and less in China, if it weren’t for liberals and their fanatic zeal for overregulation, taxation and hatred of manufacturing?

    Comment by V the K — July 3, 2012 @ 11:31 am - July 3, 2012

  15. This is what I have found from liberals on local boards :

    If you are against ACA, you want people to die in the streets.
    If you are for reasonable and effective regulation, you want people to die at the hands of evil corporations by removing ALL regulations.
    If you are for reasonable and efficient educational spending, you want all children to die from closing schools.
    If you are for reasonable and efficient welfare, food stamp and government medical spending, you want all children to die from hunger and for all the elderly to be pushed off a cliff.

    You get the idea.

    This reminds me of the OWS clown that was on Hannity’s show. Hannity offered to help him find a job. He would not take a job that paid less than $80,000. He had no experience and some unusable college degree.

    Comment by TnnsNE1 — July 3, 2012 @ 11:36 am - July 3, 2012

  16. I would love to know just how many of the “anit Walmart” protestors live in that neighborhood and how many people in that area need a job.

    As for community outreach-not aware of how much they do before putting in a store, but the Walmart here in our area donates tons of money/goods to local charities. Walmart is one of the few chain companies that always donates when a request is put in from a non profit (I sat on the board of a non profit and many chain companies just don’t donate locally-most local donations are from local business and walmart). Walmart also will donate money to a non profit organization that employees volunteer for (one of the ladies on the same board was a Walmart employee and every year she would fill out a form at work and our organization got $500 solely because she donated her time to that organization).

    Walmart may not be perfect, but in an economy that has a lot of people out of work a Walmart may very well be what that community needs-a business that will pay taxes and provide employment.

    Comment by Just Me — July 3, 2012 @ 12:17 pm - July 3, 2012

  17. The problem is society has inculcated in their young that you can be anything you want to be. True! But often times it takes time, experience, and additional training or education. Todays graduates think that with diploma in hand they have to be hired in a leadership position. After all, look at the mistake that was made in 2008, we elected a leader who has had no experience for the job as POTUS. Being a community activist is not the best preparation for a responsible career. Look at Obama´s. As a state Senator he never authored a piece of legislation and voted present 144 times. That and exposure as keynote speaker in the 2004 Democratic convention got him elected to the U.S Senate and within a year he was off campaigning for POTUS.

    Wal-Mart is expanding in El Salvador. They announced they will begin construction soon, opening in October, and they wil be hiring 300 persons. There are people out of work here and the academic year ends at the end of October. Graduates will be in that line.

    Comment by Roberto — July 3, 2012 @ 12:39 pm - July 3, 2012

  18. Cinesnatch asks “I wonder if Walgren made any effort to ingratiate itself into the community”. Does he mean did they grease enough palms like they do in Mexico and other 3rd rate countries?

    Comment by John R — July 3, 2012 @ 12:40 pm - July 3, 2012

  19. Cinesnatch, I just got to put my 2 cents in here because so many people like you just accept the biased crap from media sources.

    Yea, Walmart buys a lot of stuff from China and many other countries. Your GOOGLE link said they are buyin $18 billion from China. WMT’s gross revenues for for year ending 1/30/2012 were $446,950,000,000.00. Cost of goods sold were $335,127,000,000.00. Now I don’t know what their mark-up on $18,000,000,000 billion of goods from China is, but it AIN’T 25 times!!! Also, some simple 5th grade math tell you that $335 billion minus $18 billion leaves $317 billion cost of goods NOT from China.

    If you would look at the second link on your GOOGLE link, you would see a story from the CEO stating a lot of their STUFF comes from America. Believe him or not, the numbers don’t lie.

    You may not know this, but WMT has a huge grocery business in most of their stores. Most of the food stuff comes fron the USA, other than much of the fruit, which comes from South America.

    Last point about all this crap on our goods from China. Almost all comes on container ships, of which many shippers are American companies. Almost all imports come throug a U.S. port, where there are MANY U.S. workers. Most containers are picked up and transported via U.S. owned trucking companies, which are delivered to a big regional warehouse, which are broken down into smaller loads and delivered by American companies to a shipping dock that is staffed with Americans…… I could go on, but I hope you get the gist!!

    Walmart isn’t the bad guy, goods from China are not the pariah people make them out to be. We live in a huge global economy – embrace it and you can make some nice profits. By the way, the next big source of goods is going to be Vietnam. Go figure!!!!

    Comment by mixitup — July 3, 2012 @ 12:42 pm - July 3, 2012

  20. I wonder at those who yell about “out-sourcing” and such. Are you high protective tariff advocates? Do you want flat screen TVs that cost a fortune?

    1) Somewhat (I believe in trading, but I also believe in export/import balance) 2) Yes. I would prefer to have a humble American-made television made by an American hands (and machines), than the large screen I have now. Same goes for laptop/computer. Same goes for telephone. I buy what I can afford. And, if I can’t, f@ck ‘em. I’d rather bitch and moan to my friends (I’m exaggerating here) about what I can’t have while living in a self-reliant country who is exporting way (i.e. making money) more than it’s importing. Yes, I like my “stuff,” but I’ve always been an adaptable creature. However, I do have my limits. I am very protective of my warm showers/baths, so no negotiating there. That’s about it.

    Just yesterday, I found a competitor of mine who sells the same product for the same price and it’s made in Germany, which shocked me (if it’s true), and could be a sign that things are changing. Ironically, we all like to say our products are “German-engineered,” and now I am up against someone who may actually be speaking the truth!

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 12:44 pm - July 3, 2012

  21. These protestors, however, prefer these abstract “good jobs” to the very real “Walmart Jobs.” They favor, that is, something that exists in the abstract, in theory, to something very real

    Actually, not even that.

    Some of them think that jobs grow on trees. They think that a “good job” is something that Mommy provides you, like num-nums and blankie, and if she isn’t, it’s only because Daddy (evil GOP) is so mean.

    The others know better and just don’t want to work, period… complaining (what they call “protesting “) is easier than working, and conveniently distracts from their laziness (as they blame someone else).

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — July 3, 2012 @ 12:46 pm - July 3, 2012

  22. (continued) And finally, for some of them, protesting *is* their paid job… paid by unions, Soros, DNC etc.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — July 3, 2012 @ 12:48 pm - July 3, 2012

  23. Mix >> The numbers have come down very recently because Walmart is becoming more of a grocery chain. Now, my question is: are the groceries replacing the other sales, or are groceries a growing ancillary division augmenting other sales (which remain the same or have grown).

    Unfortunately, manufacturing in search of cheaper labor elsewhere (as China starts to organize workers, etc.) is not a solution that is pro-American-made products.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 12:51 pm - July 3, 2012

  24. Don’t you think more stuff would be made in the USA, and less in China, if it weren’t for liberals and their fanatic zeal for overregulation, taxation and hatred of manufacturing?

    That is exactly right.

    the OWS clown that was on Hannity’s show. Hannity offered to help him find a job. He would not take a job that paid less than $80,000.

    Americans are divorced from reality. It won’t last. Reality is coming for us.

    Of course, reality takes awhile to get here, so the unreality might last another few months or years. Big changes always seem like they’ll never come, until one day they do and it seems unbelievable that things used to be different.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — July 3, 2012 @ 12:57 pm - July 3, 2012

  25. “I’d rather bitch and moan to my friends (I’m exaggerating here) about what I can’t have while living in a self-reliant country ”

    Among the several mantras of leftists there is also “we are not drinking capitalist coca cola but we support foreign, 3rd worldish, anti-american Mecca cola” and rinse/repeat with any other all-american product (ford, food, drink) so color me unimpressed about your will to live in a self-reliant country.

    Fact is all leftists in america proud themselves of wanting to be a little more like Fwance, therefore your sentence is anything but belieavable.

    Comment by susan — July 3, 2012 @ 1:08 pm - July 3, 2012

  26. When I lived in Alaska, WalMart was the ONLY “big box” store in the tiny town I lived in. I had always been a bit turned off by WalMart, but I learned to like the place. Groceries are VERY expensive in Alaska, and they really helped me stretch my grocery budget. Also, I take a frickin’ handful of pills every day for my high blood pressure, and their $4 generics have saved me a fortune on my medications. My usual response to caring, compassionate liberals who despise WalMart is “why do you hate poor people? And why do you think they should have to pay more for things to make YOU feel superior?”

    Comment by Bastiat Fan — July 3, 2012 @ 1:19 pm - July 3, 2012

  27. Hi Susan >> I don’t generally drink cola or soda or pop (but I hear it’s a great agent to clean one’s toilet; not sure if generic can do the job of the name brands, though). So, stick that in your straw and drink it. And, I also try to buy all my produce locally and support local farmers. I also try to buy produce that is in season, as to not indulge a demand for products that don’t naturally occur in the part of the world I live in depending on the season we’re in. I’m not perfect. But, I try.

    Enjoy.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 1:29 pm - July 3, 2012

  28. *shrug* from the publishing PoV, American Publishers add $5-10 for the cost of a rule book, maybe as much as $20 if it was the size of the Pathfinder RPG or Slumbering Tsar. MWP made that choice (at least initially) Paizo Catalyst and most publishers have them shipped from China.

    Comment by The_Livewire — July 3, 2012 @ 1:32 pm - July 3, 2012

  29. Cinesnatch. I don’t know what you mean about “numbers coming down recently.”

    Revenues are as follows: 2008: $374B; 2009: $401B; 2010$408B; 2011: $422B; 2012: $446B. Projections for 2013 and 2014 are $473B, and $499.1B respectively. These are projections from Credit Suisse.

    I don’t see any declines in there. The incredible number is 2014 – that is 1/2 a trillion dollars in sales!!!!!!!!

    I took a short look at some research reports, and they did not break out grocery sales. I could find it, but my day is over, the US stock market is closed, and I want to have some adult beverages and LEGAL fire works tonight. But, to answer your question. WMT is the consumate retailer. They will “loss lead” lots of things, but food is a HUGE draw to bring people into the store that may not normally go. It has been incridby successful for them in bringing in new shoppers.

    You are slightly right obout US manufacturing. But, it is on the rise. We are seeing more and more starting up in the US, but it will NEVER be as it was in the 1940′s and 1950′s. Unions have seen to that and put the last nail in that coffin.

    But Cinesnatch, here is the beauty of a global economy – we DON’t need all that manufacturing to have a growing economy. We simply need more money in the hands of 330,000,000 consumers, buying goods and services every day. By doing that, we would take the current pathetic 1.6% GDP and grow it toward 3.5%, 4.0%, 4.5%, AND EVEN 5.0%!! If that happened, then we would only be fighting over what to do with all that confiscated TAX money.

    Comment by mixitup — July 3, 2012 @ 1:33 pm - July 3, 2012

  30. we DON’t need all that manufacturing to have a growing economy. We simply need more money in the hands of 330,000,000 consumers

    And where are the jobs going to come from?

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 1:47 pm - July 3, 2012

  31. I wonder at those who yell about “out-sourcing” and such.

    I wonder at progressives who wail and carry-on about outsourcing and off-shoring but are eager to import millions of illegals to work at slave wages to undercut the wages of working class Americans and take their jobs.

    Actually, I don’t wonder about it. Unemployed American workers become dependent on Government, and illegal immigrants vote for Democrats; a progressive win-win.

    Comment by V the K — July 3, 2012 @ 2:03 pm - July 3, 2012

  32. I wonder at progressives who wail and carry-on about outsourcing and off-shoring but are eager to import millions of illegals

    Are you talking about progressive business owners? Because, as a progressive business owner, I do hire illegals. Can we talk about the progressive business owners who hire illegals?

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 2:10 pm - July 3, 2012

  33. John R.

    Do you mean did Wal Mart pay the requisite fees and license to sell? Wal Mart has one unit, having bought out a Guatemalan imitator. Maybe the communist mayor was trying to get greased because the process had been stalled for months without any explanation. . The day after the Republican (ARENA) took office Wal-Mart got the green light and made the announcement. Yes and I buy many of my groceries i there because their prices are, in most cases, lower than the other two chains. They´re introducing more products from the U.S that here to fore wasn´t available.

    Comment by Roberto — July 3, 2012 @ 2:11 pm - July 3, 2012

  34. Wow, you really don’t get it.

    I did say “goods and services!”

    Let me give you a simple example. Don’t know if this will work with you, but it is right out of “realville.”

    A man owns a broom business. In 2007 he was making and shipping 150 brooms a week, employing 10 people. UPS/Fedex shipped them all over the world. Recession comes and now he only makes and ships 60 brooms a week, lays off 6 employees. UPS/Fedex ships less, also lays off employees. Orders are down because his customers have less money, make do with older broom, and less international demand. Along comes a man, call him Ronald. He finds away to get money into the hands of everyday people. Now Ms. Smith, Mr. Jones, and that guy in Italy who owns a pizza shop have some “spendable” cash and order new brooms to replace the old ones. Orders slowly start to increase. He hires back 2 people, more orders, hires back 3 more, more consumers need new brooms and now he is shipping 200+ brooms a week and has 13 employees. The UPS/Fedex shippers hire 10% more employees because shipping volume is up. The nail shop in his strip center hires 2 new girls, the Subway shop sees an increase in his business and opens another shop 2 miles away. The dry cleaners on the corner sees an increase because making brooms is a dusty business – he hires 2 people and is dreaming of franchising his business, and hires an attorney to set up the LLC.

    Now let your mind wander and think that this is happening to every pizza shop, exercise store, auto dealer, gift shop, florist,etc……., all by simply putting some free cash in the hands of a consumer. You see, it doesn’t matter where the goods are made, just that thay are shipped, stocked and purchased.

    Comment by mixitup — July 3, 2012 @ 2:13 pm - July 3, 2012

  35. Speaking of manufacturing…have you seen the announcement that Airbus is building a manufacturing plant in…wait for it….Alabama? 1,000 jobs. And why Alabama? In addition to being a state with significant pockets of high tech workers (think aerospace), it is also a right to work state, although the French would NEVER admit that is one of their reasons for siting the Airbus plant in Alabama. Roll ‘Tide.

    Comment by Mary — July 3, 2012 @ 2:27 pm - July 3, 2012

  36. I loooovvvve Walmart. Stock that is. :)

    Comment by David in New Orleans — July 3, 2012 @ 2:45 pm - July 3, 2012

  37. So, Vince admits to exploiting illegal immigrant labor in order to avoid paying fair wages to American workers. But he’s SO concerned because Wal-Mart imports things from China.

    Comment by V the K — July 3, 2012 @ 2:47 pm - July 3, 2012

  38. “I don’t generally drink cola or soda or pop. So, stick that in your straw and drink it. And, I also try to buy all my produce locally and support local farmers.”

    Always very difficult to reason with a leftist… coca cola was an example being the quintessential american product (and a monstrously successful one), this is why it is very much hated by the low brained left. Wasn’t this the sense of the book of another empty headed leftist, ‘No Logo’? It is the same mentality that goes against Walmart.

    The drinkers of Mecca cola however were not doing it for taste, money, availability or to help paleostinians cola manifacturers. They simply wanted to stick it to good old Usa. Another always intelligent behaviour from the useful idiots.

    The origin of your potatoes is not of my concern. I simply find it hard to believe that you do not fall into the stereotypical leftist pose, considering the high level of hypocrisy in those circles.

    Comment by susan — July 3, 2012 @ 2:48 pm - July 3, 2012

  39. I simply find it hard to believe that you do not fall into the stereotypical leftist pose, considering the high level of hypocrisy in those circles.

    Your take on what circles certain commenters run in is irrelevant. However, your mistaken belief that progressives are decidedly anti-capitalist says a great deal. Happy 4th Susan!

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 2:51 pm - July 3, 2012

  40. I object the term ‘progressives’ because there is nothing progressive about a faulty economic model that failed everywhere at every latitude and every time period.

    The idiotic leftists you call progressives do enjoy the benefits of capitalism, yet they want to keep those priviledges for themselves leaving the rest of the non-elites out of it. That those 2 concepts can coexist in a sea of hypocrisy is true, hence the sense of the terms ‘champagne socialist’ and ‘limousine liberal’.

    Comment by susan — July 3, 2012 @ 3:06 pm - July 3, 2012

  41. Yeah, VTK, somebody asked me to wash my car the other day and I agreed without asking him for his papers. For all I know, he could have been illegal.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 3:11 pm - July 3, 2012

  42. Real men wash their own cars, Vince.

    Comment by V the K — July 3, 2012 @ 3:12 pm - July 3, 2012

  43. Real men also clean their kitchen floors and scrub their toilets.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 3:19 pm - July 3, 2012

  44. Could someone forward Snatchy’s address to me? I want to inform the INS and ICE about illegal hiring practices.

    Regards,
    Peter H.

    Comment by Peter Hughes — July 3, 2012 @ 3:52 pm - July 3, 2012

  45. As a gay man, I WILL GLADLY trade the risk my freedom to marry for the peace of my conscious to not vote for Obama and the 2party system of vicious war.

    After President Lyndon Johnson signed the bill in 1964, Martin Luther King had the bravery and character to criticize him and the immoral Vietnam War.

    The next time I see photos of a precious child whose body has been partly blown off by drone attack bombs (or any war violence for that matter), I will be at peace knowing I did not concede or consent to accepting things as having to be this way when there are better alternative party options of peace, freedom, and liberty.

    In the social media age and in a time where most people who speak up do not have to worry about the threat of violence, there is no reason why we cannot organize to topple the 2party system. But even if we cannot topple the 2party system in this upcoming election, at the very least, we certainly do not have to validate it and its perpetual war, poverty, and attack on civil liberties with our vote.

    I’d rather put my energy into doing the right thing from the get go instead of giving into the vicious cycle of fear-based conceding for short sighted tradeoffs at the expense of other people’s suffering.

    To the victims of the weapon wars, drug law wars, poverty, illness caused by the policies of the corporately controlled 2party system, and any other injustice, I am so sorry that so many of my fellow Americans cannot emancipate themselves from the fear of voting for alternative parties. I am so sorry so many keep conceding to accepting the acceleration of human suffering as inevitable just because the powers that be creating these horrors have such great wealth – especially when WE could have the fighting spirit combined with our numbers as the 99% to organize and topple the corporately controlled 2party system.

    We got woman the right to vote. We got the Civil Rights act. We’re getting more and more LGBT equality. We can certainly topple the 2party system.

    I will never, never, never, never, never again vote for the 2party system if there is an alternative party option on my ballot. If there is no alternative party option, I will either abstain or, if allowed, write in myself.

    I will never, never, never, never, never validate, justify, or make excuses for the evils of the 2party system.

    An injustice to one is an injustice to all.

    Comment by Jeff 4 Justice — July 3, 2012 @ 4:17 pm - July 3, 2012

  46. ….with our numbers as the 99% to organize and topple the corporately controlled 2party system.

    By any chance, are you one of those ‘Occupy _____ ‘ morons?

    Comment by jman1961 — July 3, 2012 @ 4:22 pm - July 3, 2012

  47. Susan, #38 – with respect to Walmart you are partially correct. The real reason the left hates Walmart is that the Walton family, headed by Sam Walton were/are big conservatives and Republicans. The CEO and founder of Costco is a HUGE liberal. You have never seen the same type of action against any Costco super store.

    We recently saw similar stuff with the guitar maker using wood from India. The conservative guitar maker was vilified, and the lib guitar maker, using the same wood, was left alone.

    Comment by mixitup — July 3, 2012 @ 4:40 pm - July 3, 2012

  48. These people 1) don’t want to work, instead thinking that protest is work or 2) they want 30 bucks an hour for doing very little.

    Where did they learn this garbage? From Karl Marx and Comrade Obama.

    Comment by davinci — July 3, 2012 @ 5:09 pm - July 3, 2012

  49. Sonic,

    The “occupy” clowns have not got a clue. (Period.) Outsourcing and importing are the natural capitalistic reaction to high domestic prices caused by government regulations, unionized labor, myriad production restrictions and just plain government goofiness.

    I know China well. Or at least well enough. It is rapidly burning its resources into a cesspool of smog and pollution. The enormous have not class is listless and dependent on its government rice bowl welfare. The young head for the city and a bit of capitalism. The twenty dollars they send home doubles the parents yearly income. The young have to trick and connive their way into new apartments that sell for outrageous prices and are laden with acts of extortion, blackmail and the worst aspects of crony capitalism and underground economy.

    Meanwhile, the Communist rulers have to create millions of new jobs at a breakneck pace in order to stave off civil war. At the same time, the party is rife with corruption and blackmail and paranoia.

    Only a moderate or Progressive nitwit can imagine the return of the manufacturing sector to the United States that would support Wal-Mart and the rest of the retail market.

    Last winter, hay was shipped from Los Angeles to China to feed livestock. The trip to China per ton of hay was cheaper than shipping it to Central California where there was a strong demand. In the final analysis, it was more profitable for the shippers to buy high priced hay to offset the cost of sending mostly empty ships back to China where they would be filled with goods demanded at low prices in the United States.

    That is the essence of how capitalism works. Wal-Mart buys huge quantities at very low prices in China and sells them here below what other importers can afford to sell them for. Why? No union crap, a company owned and operated shipping fleet, middle line benefit packages and a very careful employee relations system that works extremely well.

    The Occupy crowd is made up of a bunch of leeches who count BMW’s and yachts and goes into a tizzy. They honestly believe that the toys of the rich equal some significant loss to each of them if only redistribution were to be put into place.

    The Chinese came to my area years ago and bought up the machinery to manufacture fabrics and recently they bought out a state of the art plant for making optics and hauled the machinery to China. Just what does anyone think they are doing that can not be done in the United States? Well, their employees work long hours for small pay and they pump their sludge into the air and down the hill.

    Can it be combatted? Your turn.

    Comment by heliotrope — July 3, 2012 @ 5:11 pm - July 3, 2012

  50. After President Lyndon Johnson signed the bill in 1964, Martin Luther King had the bravery and character to criticize him and the immoral Vietnam War.

    What could POSSIBLY be “immoral” about FIGHTING COMMUNISM? Oh wait…look who I’m talking to:

    I will never, never, never, never, never validate, justify, or make excuses for the evils of the 2party system.

    But I bet you WILL always, always, always, always, always validate, justify or make excuses for the evils of progressivism, won’t you?

    Comment by Bastiat Fan — July 3, 2012 @ 5:48 pm - July 3, 2012

  51. Can it be combatted? Your turn.

    I defer to you.

    or make excuses for the evils of progressivism, won’t you?

    J4J is a libertarian.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 6:02 pm - July 3, 2012

  52. I know buying local produce, fair trade products, organic food, and American made products makes some people feel all high and mighty, but what is the point? I say everyone should be forced to shop at Walmart and buy things that are made in China, and fair trade and organic products should be banned. That would give the anti-Walmart progressives a taste of their own medicine.

    Comment by Rattlesnake — July 3, 2012 @ 6:06 pm - July 3, 2012

  53. “An injustice to one is an injustice to all.”

    I believe in justice under the law, but there are too many laws. Just stick to the Constitution and Bill of Rights. We went way too far with fairness.

    Comment by anon23532 — July 3, 2012 @ 6:09 pm - July 3, 2012

  54. If J 4 J is actually a libertarian, my apologies.

    Comment by Bastiat Fan — July 3, 2012 @ 7:13 pm - July 3, 2012

  55. Sometimes clicking on links is very important. . .J4J has a hyperlink to his YouTube page

    Comment by rusty — July 3, 2012 @ 7:20 pm - July 3, 2012

  56. Here in NYC they’ve been fighting to stop Wal Mart, tooth and nail. A Costco moved into East Harlem in a blighted neighborhood. Soon, other stores moved in, both big box and “Mom and Pop” stores. The neighborhood is bustling with shoppers. I’ve not checked the real estate value, but I am willing to bet that the value of all of the residential property has gone up. I brought up how good business is for business and how it’s too bad we can’t get a Wal Mart in Manhattan because similar things would happen and I was drowned out with a chorus of how evil Wal Mart is. In the meantime, the price of Skippy Natural Peanut Butter at the neighborhood supermarket is $8.79. I live in a “food desert” as Mooch-elle wold say. Imagine if my fellow “food desert” inhabitants had a Wal Mart to buy from…they could afford the Natural Skippy…and get a job instead of paying with their WIC cards.

    Comment by Az Mo in NYC — July 3, 2012 @ 7:45 pm - July 3, 2012

  57. Addendum:

    A lib coworker once said that everyone should get $100,000 a year. I asked why $100,000 and he said it was a fair thing to do. I said, “why that amount, why not some other amount?” and he said, “because $100,000 is a good amount.” I kept asking why that amount and he became very angry. Another one said that no company should be able to markup a product more than 100%. I asked why? Why do you say %100 if people are willing to pay for a %400 markup. She said, “because 100% is fair.” I kept asking why %100 why not more, why not less? She INSISTED that 100% was fair and that was that. This is the insanity of progressives.

    Comment by Az Mo in NYC — July 3, 2012 @ 8:07 pm - July 3, 2012

  58. Oops, I misplaced the percentage symbols on some of those.

    Comment by Az Mo in NYC — July 3, 2012 @ 8:08 pm - July 3, 2012

  59. Skippy? B!tch, please. If you’re going to go corporate, buy Adams.

    Comment by Cinesnatch — July 3, 2012 @ 8:29 pm - July 3, 2012

  60. Snatch, how can I possibly argue with that?

    Comment by Az Mo in NYC — July 3, 2012 @ 8:57 pm - July 3, 2012

  61. I’m looking for Red Wing peanut butter. It was William F. Buckley’s favorite brand, and the man was — among so many other Renaissance qualities — a connoisseur of peanut butter.

    If anyone knows where I might find any, please let me know.

    Comment by Lori Heine — July 3, 2012 @ 10:45 pm - July 3, 2012

  62. Lori – here’s a link to Red Wing:

    http://www.buyacase.biz/redwing

    Comment by jman1961 — July 3, 2012 @ 11:24 pm - July 3, 2012

  63. 49… Dude… It was a joke! Didn’t realize I struck a nerve. Might want to examine why that nerve is so sensitive.

    Comment by sonicfrog — July 4, 2012 @ 1:17 am - July 4, 2012

  64. Let’s see:

    Why is the “Progressive” world so intent on punishing it? -Heliotrope

    Easy. Walmart is pretty much example #1 of an American success story. You’re supposed to be mediocre and miserable. Only rich bitch liberals are supposed to be successful. You’re supposed to be dependent on them. What’s more, Walmart does more for the American people than liberals do. Can’t have that.

    And then Walmart is not a union shop which exists only to keep the incompetent employed, make the union bosses richer and launder money for the DNC against the will of the employees. Liberals want Walmart to be a union shop so it can be as successful as Government Motors.

    As for community outreach-not aware of how much they do before putting in a store, -Just Me

    Well, when they opened the store here in Mulberry, FL (pop. 3,228), I remember reading that they had the Mulberry High School band perform at the ribbon cutting, after a sizable donation to the school. Yeah, Mulberry itself is small, but they pull in folks from the surrounding areas in Polk and the rural Hardee counties. There’s not much south of Mulberry, but there’s lot’s of people who live down there working for Mosaic (phosphate mines) and the citrus industry in Hardee.

    When I lived in Alaska, WalMart was the ONLY “big box” store in the tiny town I lived in. -Bastiat Fan

    I’ve heard how prominent guns are up in Alaska. Someone once told me that Walmart was great because you could buy a gun and a case of beer in the same store. ;-)

    And, I also try to buy all my produce locally and support local farmers. -Commiesnatch

    I hear ya. We all tend to buy up the Plant City strawberries. Once their season is over, we get the more expensive California strawberries which folks tend to avoid. Ditto with the citrus.

    A Costco moved into East Harlem in a blighted neighborhood. Soon, other stores moved in, both big box and “Mom and Pop” stores. The neighborhood is bustling with shoppers. I’ve not checked the real estate value, -Az Mo in NYC

    I guarandamntee you that it’s unfair that real estate values are going up and causing fewer “affordable housing” to be available. Check Zillow.com anyways.

    Comment by TGC — July 4, 2012 @ 3:56 am - July 4, 2012

  65. Someone once told me that Walmart was great because you could buy a gun and a case of beer in the same store. ;-)

    And I don’t know of any other sates that allow it but in Indianapolis, I found out that you can buy liquor in Walmart. Down here in FL, you have to go to a liquor store. Some stores like Winn Dixie, Publix and Walgreens have liquor stores attached, but they can’t have a door connecting them.

    However, we do have what I call the airline bottles of liquor. Haven’t seen that anywhere else I’ve been. Sure you don’t get much liquor, but it’s great if you want to try something new and don’t want to buy a 1/5 only to find out you hate it.

    Comment by TGC — July 4, 2012 @ 4:00 am - July 4, 2012

  66. [...] a good thing The Colossus of Rhodey – Hube’s James Bond Bests (and Worsts) Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? The Mellow Jihadi – Muslim Targets VA Right! – My Doctor Is a Flaming Pro-ObamaCare Liberal – [...]

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  68. [...] Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract ?good? to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by This Week’s Watcher’s Council Results | therightplanet.com — July 4, 2012 @ 7:21 am - July 4, 2012

  69. [...] a good thingThe Colossus of Rhodey – Hube’s James Bond Bests (and Worsts)Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real?The Mellow Jihadi – Muslim TargetsVA Right! - My Doctor Is a Flaming Pro-ObamaCare Liberal – [...]

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  71. Their heads are stuck so high up their asses that they couldn’t care less about real people. Only some stupid ideal. btw, Walmart is wonderful because it allows people to buy products they otherwise could never afford.
    Of course the Elites hate this since then there is no difference between them and the poor.

    Comment by Leah — July 4, 2012 @ 12:42 pm - July 4, 2012

  72. [...] Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by Trevor Loudon's New Zeal Blog — July 4, 2012 @ 1:47 pm - July 4, 2012

  73. You all might be interested in the part played by professional protestor/plants who are sent into Wal-Mart just like Sandra Fluke was sent into a Catholic college.
    Girshriela Green is Wal-Mart’s demon.
    She was unemployed and Wal-Mart gave her a job.
    She had 6 children (or maybe only 3).
    She got hurt and took disability, hasn’t worked for a year.
    But she manages to criss-cross the country protesting Wal-Marts.
    Here’s much more:
    http://michaelscomments.wordpress.com/2012/07/01/some-stellar-reporting-on-walmart/

    Comment by Nan G — July 4, 2012 @ 4:14 pm - July 4, 2012

  74. [...] Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

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  76. [...] Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by Watcher’s Council Nominations – America’s Birthday Edition | askmarion — July 5, 2012 @ 3:39 am - July 5, 2012

  77. [...] Contemporary liberalism:preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by GayPatriot » Watcher of Weasels — Independence Edtion — July 5, 2012 @ 3:44 am - July 5, 2012

  78. [...] Flaming Pro-ObamaCare Liberal – Time to Change Doctors! Third place with 2 votes – Gay Patriot-Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? Fourth place with 1 vote – The Noisy Room- Obama Lies, Taxes Rise Fifth place *t* with 2/3 vote [...]

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  79. [...] Third place with 2 votes – Gay Patriot-Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by This Week’s Watcher’s Council Results | therightplanet.com — July 6, 2012 @ 6:34 am - July 6, 2012

  80. [...] Third place with 2 votes – Gay Patriot-Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by The Council Has Spoken! Winners Are Up! | Independent Sentinel — July 6, 2012 @ 7:32 am - July 6, 2012

  81. [...] Third place with 2 votes – Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

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  82. [...] Third place with 2 votes – Gay Patriot-Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by GayPatriot » Watcher of Weasels — First Winners of July 2012 — July 6, 2012 @ 5:39 pm - July 6, 2012

  83. [...] Third place with 2 votes – Gay Patriot-Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by Bookworm Room » Watcher’s Council winners for July 6, 2012 — July 6, 2012 @ 6:27 pm - July 6, 2012

  84. [...] Gay Patriot – Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by Watcher’s Council Nominations – America’s Birthday Edition | — July 6, 2012 @ 7:18 pm - July 6, 2012

  85. [...] excited about real paying jobs coming to L.A., insisted that they would be better off with some hypothetical Mom and Pop jobs that might arise if they protested Walmart with sufficient vigor: Last week, when watching TV news footage of people [...]

    Pingback by Bookworm Room » Why does the Left love Mom and Pop stores, but hate Mom and Pop medicine? — July 7, 2012 @ 9:12 pm - July 7, 2012

  86. [...] Third place with 2 votes – Gay Patriot-Contemporary liberalism: preferring the abstract “good” to the imperfect real? [...]

    Pingback by The Usual Genius | — July 8, 2012 @ 10:33 pm - July 8, 2012

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