Americans now do? Americans have seen more and more of the GDP get sucked up by a bloated healthcare system that has huge overhead costs

That is a good point. Let me rephrase my comment; I wouldn’t legalize anything unhealthy as long as I have to pay for the consequences in any way, whether it is through an actual universal healthcare system or not. The only way I would support legalizing those things would be through a purely free market health system.

We’ve been paying more and more, with worse and worse results, and we’re steadily getting sicker and fatter.

Comment by Levi — November 8, 2012 @ 3:31 pm – November 8, 2012

I love the sight of Levi, who openly advocates for drug use, promiscuous and irresponsible sex, and restrictions being removed on the use of EBT cards wondering why society is getting “sicker and fatter”.

The clue meter nearly explodes.

Public healthcare systems are far better at reigning in costs and delivering better service, as is evidenced by the the rest of the developed world and the public healthcare options (that are enormously popular I might add) that exist in this country.

Comment by Levi — November 8, 2012 @ 3:31 pm – November 8, 2012

Actually, people on public healthcare in the United States are as a rule sicker and fatter than those on private insurance.

The percentage of annual medical expenditures in each state attributable to obesity ranges from 4 percent (Arizona) to 6.7 percent (Alaska). For Medicare expenditures, the percentage ranges from 3.9 percent (Arizona) to 9.8 percent (Delaware). For Medicaid recipients, the percentages are much higher, ranging from 7.7 percent (Rhode Island) to 15.7 percent (Indiana). The higher percentage of Medicaid expenditures attributed to obesity results from the higher prevalence of obesity among Medicaid recipients.

So if you wanted people to get healthier, you would get them OFF government health care and put them on to private care, where there are penalties for smoking, being obese, and so forth.

But the problem is, Levi, that you don’t really care about peoples’ health; you care about getting free health care and sending the bill to someone else, because you’re a lazy moocher and taker who thinks his money is better spent on buying weed.

Just like Sandra Fluke.

I wouldn’t legalize anything that is unhealthy as long as I have to pay for the consequences, which you Americans now do via Obamacare. The liberty of marijuana smokers may have increased, but I can’t say the same for the liberty of those who are more responsible and don’t use drugs.

Americans now do? Americans have seen more and more of the GDP get sucked up by a bloated healthcare system that has huge overhead costs, embarrassingly poor results compared to the rest of the developed world (where healthcare is a public service), and that’s left millions of people completely uncovered. If you want to make healthcare costs an issue about liberty, than you can’t say the problem starts with Obamacare, because its been gestating for decades. We’ve been paying more and more, with worse and worse results, and we’re steadily getting sicker and fatter. Public healthcare systems are far better at reigning in costs and delivering better service, as is evidenced by the the rest of the developed world and the public healthcare options (that are enormously popular I might add) that exist in this country.

And yes, debt, people trying to kill us, and people trying to drag us kicking and screaming into the future are all more important than the freedom to engage in risky behaviour…

But, it is possible to walk and chew gum at the same time. Just because some states voted to allow pot doesn’t mean that they sacrificed other legislation to do so.

The perfect stooge/tool of the democrat communists.

Most of the teenage pot heads around here don’t have much gumption either. They mostly end up heading down a dead end road and usually in some way or the other receiving state aid of one kind or another (welfare, food stamps, SSI, etc).

Comment by Just Me — November 7, 2012 @ 3:36 pm – November 7, 2012

Which is, oddly enough, borne out by scientific evidence.

The results of the present study suggest that increasing cannabis use in late adolescence and early adulthood is associated with a range of adverse outcomes in later life. High levels of cannabis use are related to poorer educational outcomes, lower income, greater welfare dependence and unemployment and lower relationship and life satisfaction.

The funny part is that we criminalize alcohol and tobacco use for people under the age of 21. Yet Levi and the Barack Obama Party scream and piss themselves that children and teenagers should be ENCOURAGED to smoke pot, even though there is evidence that it is bad for them.

Once again, though, why would Levi and the Barack Obama Party actively seek to keep people OFF the welfare rolls? They want people dependent on the government and too stoned to do anything but comply.

And if your kids’ teacher enjoys drinking, would you apply the same standard?

Alcohol leaves the system relatively quickly and if my kid’s teacher was an alcoholic I would object. I am not a huge fan of the abuse of alcohol either.

Most of the teenage pot heads around here don’t have much gumption either. They mostly end up heading down a dead end road and usually in some way or the other receiving state aid of one kind or another (welfare, food stamps, SSI, etc).

I’d so much rather find a joint in my kid’s sock drawer than find out they were getting hammered every weekend. Not only is marijuana safer, it’s healthier, you’re more in control of your body, and you don’t black out.

So, then, it’s pretty much like smokeable broccoli, no? This despite the increasing body of knowledge that the use of mind-altering substances on underdeveloped brains has long-lasting and potentially lifelong effects. I do hope you won’t be one of those parents portrayed in a story on local drug use by my daily paper a few years ago who bought her son a bong for his sixteenth birthday so they could use it and toke together. (Giving another meaning to “family bonding”, I guess.)

Aside from that, y’know what I see more and more of in the local stories about drunk driving? That it’s not just alcohol the offenders are using. I’d say about 4 out of 5 those arrested–particularly those under 40–are also found with marijuana and/or crystal methamphetamine in their possession. Now are we to assume that somehow they are only using alcohol before or during their time behind the wheel? Sorry, but I don’t want to be in close enough proximity of them to find out. Further, if alcohol is so antithetical to pot users’ kind and gentle nature, why is so much of it sold in bars where alcohol is sold? It seems to me there is indeed a connection between marijuana and alcohol and other drugs and that connection isn’t just a few bad seeds who don’t really understand that they shouldn’t mix something (which they think should be sold in a health food store) with other nasty substances.

Comment by Levi — November 7, 2012 @ 1:06 pm – November 7, 2012

Because, Levi, as I pointed out above, liberals and the Barack Obama Party scream that you shouldn’t fire drunk teachers and try to punish people for doing so.

You’re denying reality. You endorse and support protecting the drunk, just like you endorse and support protecting the tokers who drive high and show up to work high.

You want a consequence-free world. That’s typical. It is the childish view of the Obama Party, the view in which everything is always someone else’s fault and someone else owes you paying your bills.

Like I said, the game is over. Republicans will hike taxes on everyone now. We tried giving Obama shills like yourself a break under the theory that you would take advantage of it and better yourself; instead, all you did was scream for more food stamps, more Obamaphones, and fewer work requirements.

In that case, the game is now simple. You will pay taxes or you will have no income. In fact, I am now going to advocate that Republicans impose taxes on welfare benefits. Since you want to pay the government, we will give you exactly what you want.

So because it isn’t quite as impairing, the impairment shouldn’t be viewed as all that significant.

Well, yes. There’s Tylenol and then there’s morphine. Different drugs have different effects. Obviously, impairment is an issue, but what I’m trying to explain to you is that impairment from marijuana is more likely to keep you at home and off the road to begin with. And believe me, you’re far better off driving down the pothead’s street than you are the alcoholic’s.

Honestly, if my kids teacher is toking up anywhere, I don’t want them to be my kid’s teacher.

And if your kids’ teacher enjoys drinking, would you apply the same standard? By literally any metric, alcohol is a much worse drug than marijuana. I’ve said it before – I’d so much rather find a joint in my kid’s sock drawer than find out they were getting hammered every weekend. Not only is marijuana safer, it’s healthier, you’re more in control of your body, and you don’t black out.

It sounds to me like you don’t have a whole lot of experience with marijuana, but let me just reassure you that if you’re comfortable enough living in a society that allows the consumption of alcohol, you have absolutely nothing to worry about from people that want to smoke marijuana.

I don’t want the union to hire a lawyer and make all sorts of arguments about how they are being discriminated against.

If you want to smoke dope, fine, but don’t expect the world to accommodate, affirm or financially support your decision.

And that’s really the point. ‘If you want to smoke dope, fine.’ Nobody is asking for accommodation or affirmation or financial support, they’re asking to be allowed to exercise a fundamental personal right that doesn’t have anything to do with anybody

And you can’t claim discrimination for drinking alcohol, why should we worry about people claiming discrimination because they like weed? Nothing is different in this regard. If you show up to work drunk and your boss figures it out, he has grounds to fire you. Same thing if you show up to work high.

You won’t be able to just smoke anywhere at any time. A teacher chugging martinis during recess can be fired on the spot, and so could a teacher taking bong rips in their van during recess.

Comment by Levi — November 7, 2012 @ 11:10 am – November 7, 2012

Lie.

It’s a theme that the U.F.T. has embraced. The union’s Web site has a section that features stories highlighting the injustice of the Rubber Rooms. One, which begins “Bravo!,” is about a woman I’ll call Patricia Adams, whose return to her classroom, at a high school in Manhattan, last year is reported as a vindication. The account quotes a speech that Adams made to union delegates; according to the Web site, she received a standing ovation as she declared, “My case should never have been brought to a hearing.” The Web site account continues, “Though she believes she was the victim of an effort to move senior teachers out of the system, the due process tenure system worked in her case.”

And for what was she “vindicated”?

On November 23, 2005, according to a report prepared by the Education Department’s Special Commissioner of Investigation, Adams was found “in an unconscious state” in her classroom. “There were 34 students present in [Adams’s] classroom,” the report said. When the principal “attempted to awaken [Adams], he was unable to.” When a teacher “stood next to [Adams], he detected a smell of alcohol emanating from her.”

Screaming Levi now is out to protect the dopers just like he protects the drunks.

Stop thinking with your genitals.

So because it isn’t quite as impairing, the impairment shouldn’t be viewed as all that significant.

Honestly, if my kids teacher is toking up anywhere, I don’t want them to be my kid’s teacher.

I don’t want the union to hire a lawyer and make all sorts of arguments about how they are being discriminated against.

If you want to smoke dope, fine, but don’t expect the world to accommodate, affirm or financially support your decision.

But supposed conservatives are saying i am limiting “personal freedom”, but what if the healthcare panels or government panels do the same thing? so it is ok for govt to outlaw transfats and 24 oz drinks and certain life saving medical procedures but not pot? do people realize how ridiculous this all sounds/is?

i am willing to bet there are ton of people who are all for the nanny state when it comes to death panels and soda bans and legal dope.

BTW I think there is a case to be made for ending the drug war (which is pretty much a failure) and decriminalization of pot.

I just want employers to be able to say “if you use drugs in or outside of employment hours, we do not want you as our employee” without fearing the person hiring an army of lawyers to come sue them. I want the choice to get high to come with consequences.

the country just got flushed for 4 more years of socialism and someone is happy about legal pot. this is what is sowrong with so many in this country:

what they think is a “civil right” is actually selfishness.

i always thought to get busted smoking or carrying minimal amounts of pot should just be a misdemeanor. as long as you are not a dealer even, i saw consider it a misdemeanor.

but no, even that strategy is supposed a cost/price that is too much to bear.

so lets see, we legalize all the illegal drugs for use, slash the military, raise taxes on everyone and do you all really think we will stop the blood letting of fiscal irresponsibility?

again, look to greece & europe.

europe has done all that the left and those on the right, are saying to do and no one wants to take personal responsibility. personal freedom does not mean I have to pay for your “right” to live dangerously.

there simply isnt enough money in the world to feed those people who are addicted to government funding of their f*ked up lifestyles.

just so everyone knows, no amount of legalization and funding of illegal drugs, and contraception for that matter, will prevent the drug addictions and STDs that are the outcome of all of this irresponsible DEBT INCREASING behavior. But supposed conservatives are saying i am limiting “personal freedom”, but what if the healthcare panels or government panels do the same thing? so it is ok for govt to outlaw transfats and 24 oz drinks and certain life saving medical procedures but not pot? do people realize how ridiculous this all sounds/is?

lets get real folks, a few big reasons that health care costs have ballooned is because people have become sick due to their own careless and dangerous behavior with drugs, illegal or legal, and the way MANY live promiscuous lives.

I and you pay for these people and that intrudes on my individual to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness.

sadly, last night & this thread on this site proves the USA electorate at this time doesnt really care.

selfishness.

Now hush Levi, the adults are talking.

Except that now that it is safe to smoke your joint anywhere, anytime, there may be more stoned drivers.

And honestly I really don’t want my kid’s bus company hiring people who smoke pot. I don’t care if the cashier at the grocery store tokes up every night, but I want employers who hire people for jobs to be able to tell stoners to apply elsewhere if those people are working in a job where my or my children’s safety could be compromised.

Legalizing it though, means it is government approved (which is why I am more of a dicriminalization oriented person than legalization) and means the stoner gets to sue the school board if they want to fire the teacher for toking up during lunch break.

You won’t be able to just smoke anywhere at any time. A teacher chugging martinis during recess can be fired on the spot, and so could a teacher taking bong rips in their van during recess.

I’m not exactly thrilled about facing off with stoned drivers either, but like I said, marijuana is already super-obtainable and it’s something you’re already dealing with. However, marijuana does not have the same effect on peoples’ judgment that alcohol does. People get drunk and stumble into their cars because they get the adrenaline pumping and they feel invincible and over confident. None of these are the effects of marijuana use, you’re more likely to sit at home watching TV eating Oreos. In fact, with marijuana as an alternative to alcohol, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a decrease in alcohol-related crimes and accidents. Potheads don’t get into bar fights. Potheads don’t decide to go drag-racing. Win-win-win-win-win. (Just so long as Obama doesn’t bring down the hammer.)

Put down that joint Levi and listen up, man, cause I mean YOU!

(Bruce, Dan, and Nick – you might as well just ban me now before I get really ugly with the Dem trash)