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  1. Barack Obama owns it now. Let’s see if he will man up and do what really needs to be done. Have some humility Barack and lead by working with both parties. Otherwise the world, and our country, will fall into complete disarray. No one thinks you are a leader, so you had better show that you are. Lord, please help us.

    Comment by AZMarineMom — November 7, 2012 @ 1:48 am - November 7, 2012

  2. Let the obstructionism end in Congress and he WILL!

    Comment by noose — November 7, 2012 @ 1:57 am - November 7, 2012

  3. Up until the storm hit, Mitt had the momentum. And it stopped.

    According to the following Silver graph, the Mittmentum started after the first debate and ended roughly a little after the VP debate before mid-October and never recovered.

    Comment by Vince Smetana — November 7, 2012 @ 1:58 am - November 7, 2012

  4. Obama has been a failed president in His first term, and there is no reason to think His second will be any better. It is puzzling, that vast swaths of the American people (even if only a razor-thin majority) would choose such a failure.

    One could go on about media malpractice, and be right – It has been worse in this election than I’ve ever seen – and one could also rightly question the wisdom, even the intelligence, of Obama voters. But all that would miss the point.

    At the end of the day, Americans chose the way they chose. They knew what they were doing, on some level. That does not mean they chose wisely; I say they didn’t. But a razor-thin majority preferred the deficit-spending, manipulating, lying failure over Romney. That was their choice to make.

    Talk about hurricanes and “momentum” misses the point, just as much as talking about media malpractice and “low-information” voters. People chose the way they chose. The choice was theirs to make. They made it. A week, or a hurricane, made no real difference. Romney did not close the sale. A thin majority simply preferred Obama, despite His being a failure.

    I suspected that something like this could happen, when the GOP ticket started trying to out-Democrat the Democrats on Medicare. But maybe that can be a comment for another time.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 1:59 am - November 7, 2012

  5. Barack Obama owns it now. Let’s see if he will man up and do what really needs to be done.

    It would surprise me. I expect 4 more years of Obama lying, leading from behind, and attempting to blame Bush for the fact that Obama’s own policies can’t and won’t produce a real economic recovery.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 2:02 am - November 7, 2012

  6. Since economies are cyclical, it could be that despite our impending fiscal cliff, despite tax hikes (end of Bush tax rates, increases), despite continued regulation of energy, the full implementation of Obamacare, etc. that our economy could improve and Obama will benefit just as Clinton benefited from an economic cycle. It could be that Obama together with congressional leaders could cobble something together that will put off the inevitable and his supporters will conclude he saved the nation from economic ruin, that his message of ‘Forward’ and ‘Let’s not return to the ruinous policies of the past’ was correct. And we will have another generation of economic illiterates whose wishful, emotional ideas about which party is more economically sound will be affirmed.

    Comment by Ignatius — November 7, 2012 @ 2:24 am - November 7, 2012

  7. Isaac and Sandy certainly didn’t help. (Nor did Chris Christie’s willingness to aid the Obama campaign. My estimation of him has certainly declined.) I don’t think Benghazi will amount to anything, frankly; Republicans are tired from the campaign and Obama has too many covering for him. I wish the GOP would make a better effort to welcome non-white voters. I know that earns me the moniker ‘troll’ here at GayPatriot (the irony is apparently lost on some around here) but I’m convinced that even a small shift of black/Hispanic/Asian votes might have really helped us tonight — and in the future.

    Comment by Ignatius — November 7, 2012 @ 2:41 am - November 7, 2012

  8. It could be that Obama together with congressional leaders could cobble something together that will put off the inevitable and his supporters will conclude he saved the nation

    And maybe pigs could fly.

    That sounds harsher than I mean it. I simply mean that economic laws can’t be defied. Policies which use up real capital in direct consumption, discourage its formation, discourage job creation and entrepreneurship, discourage hard work, attempt to restore broken investment bubbles based on excessive debt, and basically make war on production and trade, cannot produce a robust economy.

    Given a sufficient amount of borrow-and-spend, they can produce an *illusion* of a robust economy, just like a family can borrow-and-spend to create a temporary illusion of success while they bankrupt themselves.

    But the U.S. won’t be able to borrow enough. We have already borrowed and spent too much; same with Europe, Japan and now even China. All of us will be hitting the same wall (too much debt, combined with too much government) at the same time. None of us will have real money to lend to the others, to keep the other’s illusion of success going. All of us are ‘in for it’, big – including Obama.

    A worldwide depression awaits. There is no scenario where, given His current policy set, He comes out on top. If He should change over to policies of sound money and small government (which would allow deleveraging, capital formation, production and trade): More power to Him. But again: and maybe pigs will fly.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 2:45 am - November 7, 2012

  9. Having no watchdog media, for sure. Total propaganda arm. And perhaps a lot of those electronic booths were rigged. Razor thin margins? Uh….yeah. Not to mention the military vote being disenfranchised. Venezuela has gone to shit under Chavez, his opponent was up in the polls, but yet he, too, found a million votes.

    Under this media, this DoJ, and this communist, it’s balls to the wall. There is noone, the past four years has proven that, to stop him or do anything about anything.

    Comment by Annie — November 7, 2012 @ 2:46 am - November 7, 2012

  10. ILC, you know it and I know it, Obama wants it all to come tumbling down.

    Comment by Annie — November 7, 2012 @ 2:48 am - November 7, 2012

  11. I wish the GOP would make a better effort to welcome non-white voters. I know that earns me the moniker ‘troll’ here

    ???????????? I would doubt that anyone has ever earned that moniker here, for constructive suggestions to improve GOP voter outreach.

    I’ve seen some people earn it for wild attacks on social conservatives, wild suggestions that people who think border control is important are ‘racists’, etc. – but that’s not GOP voter outreach.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 2:53 am - November 7, 2012

  12. The electoral map is so narrow for the GOP. It was really shown tonight. Obama had many scenarios to pull out a victory.
    Romney had 1.
    From what I see the Margin of Popular Vote is growing and will continue to grow for the rest of the night.

    In my view its focusing only economic issues and dropping the social issues.
    No more discussion of Abortion.
    No more amendments to limit gay marriage.
    No more Anti-Immigration crap.
    No more “America is a Christian Nation” kind of rhetoric.
    No more talking about rape.
    No more alienating talking points about “takers”

    Focus on the economy, spending, taxes and responsible governance.

    Be fiscally conservative and let the conservative lifestyle be a personal decision and not on the ballot.
    Basically Become the Tories in the UK.

    Do this and the NE is back in play and possibly the NW.
    Don’t and every election will depend on the same “hail mary” map that Romney relied on.

    Comment by mike — November 7, 2012 @ 2:57 am - November 7, 2012

  13. mike, Romney did not rely on a “hail mary” pass and the map was hardly narrow. Romney didn’t focus on the social issues.

    And the electoral map is not so narrow for GOP. Pennsylvania was a 5-point race. Minnesota, Wisconsin and Michigan were all much closer than in ’08.

    Who knows what would have happened had Sandy not broken Mitt’s momentum. Right now, it looks like Obama will win it with a popular vote margin almost identical to the one W enjoyed in 2004 — and possibly fewer votes than McCain won in 2008 (although I’m still not sure how many votes are outstanding).

    And that, to me, is what is truly stunning about this race. We have to wait until the final count comes in, but it looks like Mitt Romney, who ran a much better campaign than John McCain, may end up with fewer votes than the Arizona Senator.

    Comment by B. Daniel Blatt — November 7, 2012 @ 3:11 am - November 7, 2012

  14. I believe strongly that our markets are moved primarily through manipulation for political reasons (gold, the dollar, trade policies, labor, subsidies and licenses, etc.) and I have no reason to think a catastrophe cannot be similarly averted or at least put off. Economic cycles are manipulated as much as natural results of human activity. I doubt a robust economy is Obama’s goal (especially that he will no longer seek re-election); an economy that is in a slow, steady decline is far preferable. In fact, it is the result of control, i.e. improvements are sought if political gains are sought. The free market is largely an illusion, something we stopped practicing many decades ago. (Seriously, does anyone pay attention to monetary velocity any longer?) A worldwide depression is possible but I hesitate to say ‘likely’ for the wrong reason, meaning a likely depression occurs when natural economic forces are allowed to function. A corrective action is usually a benefit, despite short-term hardship. I wish I could be more optimistic that Obama cannot escape market forces, but manipulators are too good at their art.

    Comment by Ignatius — November 7, 2012 @ 3:22 am - November 7, 2012

  15. Romney may not have campaigned on social issues, but the Obama campaign hammered away at Romney using the GOP’s social issues against the Party. Romney’s advisers and staff left the Democrats frame the election issues…and Romney wasn’t helped by others in the GOP preaching Social-Conservative “values” when no-one when polled placed soc-con issues as important.

    The GOP operatives and lesser-level candidates placed principle over electoral success…alienating the “Middle”, the Youth-vote and the Women, the Hispanics, and the moderate G/L community that supported the Bushes.

    Comment by Ted B. (Charging Rhino) — November 7, 2012 @ 3:28 am - November 7, 2012

  16. Here.

    Comment by Ignatius — November 7, 2012 @ 3:32 am - November 7, 2012

  17. I believe strongly that our markets are moved primarily through manipulation for political reasons

    Largely agree.

    I have no reason to think a catastrophe cannot be similarly averted or at least put off.

    Reaching the end of the road. Obama is about to find Himself the captain of the Titanic.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 3:35 am - November 7, 2012

  18. Here.

    Missed that one. OK, maybe it wasn’t Bruce’s best moment.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 3:39 am - November 7, 2012

  19. I think the primary hurt Romney, mostly because it went on too long. It allowed the media to focus on Republican division and gave candidates like Santorum, Gingrich, and Perry (all of whom had no chance of winning) voices much larger than they deserved. I also think Romney’s campaign didn’t take enough time introducing him to Americans. I wanted to see just one TV ad with Romney speaking plainly into the camera about who he is and what he’d like to do rather than montages of factories, trucks being loaded, hands being shaken, all to busy-sounding music. I think many were shocked that Romney appeared so reasonable in the debates — but that’s a criticism of the Romney campaign, not a compliment to Romney: if you haven’t successfully introduced yourself by debate time, your strategy is seriously flawed.

    Comment by Ignatius — November 7, 2012 @ 3:43 am - November 7, 2012

  20. Romney crushed it with the white vote (59-39) and won Independents (50-45), but that’s no longer enough to win by itself.

    Will your party finally stop bashing brown people, gay people, and respect the rights of women? As a Democrat, I won’t mind if the GOP continues its self-immolation, stubbornly denying our changing demographics, but it would be good for the country.

    The GOP might want to give it a try. Otherwise, you’ll have more nights like tonight.

    Comment by Erik — November 7, 2012 @ 4:01 am - November 7, 2012

  21. Erik, the party doesn’t bash brown people, gay people and doesn’t disrespect the rights of women.

    But, it does need to do a better job of outreach to Hispanic Americans; that was perhaps Romney’s biggest failure.

    Comment by B. Daniel Blatt — November 7, 2012 @ 4:16 am - November 7, 2012

  22. I just think in the end,the legacy media proved it still had clout and also the Democrats showed they could win an election at will.

    I think our country has reached a tipping point and unless idealogical changes happen in the legacy media,we’re never going to overcome the propagand power of Hollywood on the west coast and Big Media on the east coast and unions in the middle.

    I think talk radio and conservative websites have done as much as they can do and now it’s all downhill from here.
    The Dems won’t even have to enact the Fairness Doctrine ,because they took the Tea Party and conservatives best shot and came out swinging with a knockout punch.

    And the thing about it is,Obama can now absolutely destroy this country and get away with it because who’s gonna hold him accountable?

    Goodbye Gateway Pundit.
    Goodbye Drudgereport
    Goodbye Breitbart
    Goodbye Blaze website
    Goodbye talk radio

    It was a fantastic four years,but I can’t take another four years of constantly being on edge and angry about crap that won’t make any difference in the outcome of an election.
    And besides,Obama’s not running for reelection in 2016 and the Democrats hold the Senate and will ALWAYS forevermore hold the Senate,so Obama is UNTOUCHABLE.

    Comment by ebayer — November 7, 2012 @ 4:29 am - November 7, 2012

  23. Keep in mind — in the three way race of 1992, Clinton received 83% of the black vote, 61% of the Latino vote, and 39% of the white vote — the same percentage Obama earned yesterday — and Clinton won just 43% of the popular vote.

    With 93% of the black vote, 71% of the Latino vote, 73% of the Asian vote, and just 39% of the white vote, Obama won 50% of the popular vote.

    The White vote was 83% of the total in 1992. It was 72% yesterday. Conceding that much of the electorate to the Democrats is simply too deep a hole.

    Comment by Erik — November 7, 2012 @ 4:30 am - November 7, 2012

  24. You think lack of “outreach” is to blame for your party’s loss of 71% of the Latino vote?

    LOL.

    Comment by Erik — November 7, 2012 @ 4:36 am - November 7, 2012

  25. You know what? You’re right. Just keep doing what you’re doing.

    You’re getting hammered in the minority vote, youth vote, and women’s vote (you lost it 55-44), not because you’re party’s positions are offensive to those groups, but because you just haven’t performed enough “outreach.”

    Keep talking about “forcible” and “legitimate” rape. Keeping talking about about the “papers please” law in Arizona. Keep talking about “defending” marriage.

    If you just do more “outreach,” that’ll make all your woes disappear.

    Right.

    Comment by Erik — November 7, 2012 @ 4:52 am - November 7, 2012

  26. I really don’t think it’s about the hurricane, or the primaries, or a failure to reach minorities. I think it’s because people simply believe the left’s message that conservatives are mean, racist people who hate the poor and somehow destroyed the economy. That’s the message I hear every day and that’s the mindset of people around me. Republicans need to start fighting back against the misinformation. Think about this – for four years now the President has been blaming the bad economy on Republicans and Republicans are not fighting back, so people believe it. It’s days like today, when the country reelects a clueless, vindictive failure over a clearly capable leader that this is most evident. As long as we let the left define us, we will fail.

    Comment by mnscorpio — November 7, 2012 @ 5:31 am - November 7, 2012

  27. Even if the GOP did flip on all the social issues, the MFM and the left would still demonize them. So, I don’t see the point really.

    Comment by V the K — November 7, 2012 @ 5:40 am - November 7, 2012

  28. Dan wrote:

    “Erik, the party doesn’t bash brown people, gay people and doesn’t disrespect the rights of women.

    But, it does need to do a better job of outreach to Hispanic Americans; that was perhaps Romney’s biggest failure.”

    What does that outreach look like? That deserves a really good blog post. In my opinion, the GOP has got to officially abandon this idea that coming across the border illegally is the wort thing since murder. Yes, I’m exaggerating a bit. But this party comes off as horrifically xenophobic at best when it comes to Latinos and immigration. You guys cheered on Arizona. But in the end the hyper reactive situation there is a self inflicted wound that will take a long time to heal.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 7, 2012 @ 5:54 am - November 7, 2012

  29. Obama only told his lies once. It took the media repeating it over and over again to convince the American people that he was trustworthy.

    The people of the United States of America are OWNED by the mass media.

    The theme for the next four years: ‘Revenge’. Kiss your rights goodbye!

    Comment by gastorgrab — November 7, 2012 @ 6:07 am - November 7, 2012

  30. Who wants to guess if there is a “tremendous popular outcry” (the phrasing the media will use) in 2016 for presidential term limits to be removed?

    Comment by gastorgrab — November 7, 2012 @ 6:09 am - November 7, 2012

  31. Hispanic outreach? How about Spanish language conservative talk radio for starters.

    Comment by V the K — November 7, 2012 @ 6:19 am - November 7, 2012

  32. Erik, I am not american so this election touches me marginally only, but considering you put together ‘brown people’, immigrants and gays in your highly intelligent democratic party, just can you please summarize how popular is gay marriage in latino countries, ‘brown people’ countries and countries where the majority of immigrants come from (africa, the middle east, muslim asia).

    I would suggest caution in gloating, just the other day I have read the majority of gay beatings is done by ‘brown people’.

    Please do not get me wrong, I think this is poetic justice at its finest. Can’t wait how you will manage your hot potato when the democratic base is full of muslims, latinos, ‘brown people’ and other aggressive minorities that unlike gays breed at a very high rate. Which bus do you think ‘the gheys’ will be thrown under?

    FYI, some areas of Amsterdam after decades of liberalism are now dangerous for homosexuals and women, the 2 categories leftists wanted to protect. It is a microcosm of what is going to come in bigger countries.

    Comment by susan — November 7, 2012 @ 6:40 am - November 7, 2012

  33. Romney only has himself to blame. If he chose Rubio, he would have won handily. Instead, he chose a sixth son in Paul Ryan, and made the same mistake as McCain in going with his crush instead of the best choice.

    Your vast distortion of the facts in the piece has made me lose all the resect I had for you.

    Face it: The GOP can’t win unless Rove pulls the strings. GOP has been a failed antigay, antiwoman, antiminority party of hate.

    Comment by Rubio — November 7, 2012 @ 7:09 am - November 7, 2012

  34. susan,

    Erik just judges people by the colour of their skin, not the quality of their character. (He also ignores Ted Cruz, Bobby Jindal, Mia Love, etc etc because he wants to cling to his simple colour coded view of the world.)

    I’d argue that the problem is, too many people do.

    Comment by The_Livewire — November 7, 2012 @ 7:47 am - November 7, 2012

  35. Romney (and many fellow Republicans) lost because the Republican Party has created a set of social “wedge” issues that are driving segments of the population away. Gay rights, women’s rights, immigration, abortion, and lifestyle are show stoppers for these groups. Romney might not have espoused these positions but he didn’t distance himself from them either. He defacto inherited them by not stating otherwise. In the end it didn’t matter what his economic or budgetary positions were. He was undone by the fact there is a percentage of the population which wrote him off without further consideration. The sad part is, four years from now, if the Party doesn’t change, we’ll do this all over again with the same result.

    Comment by David — November 7, 2012 @ 7:48 am - November 7, 2012

  36. Dare we ask to what extent distortions of the election process itself were a factor? I am reluctant to bring it up because it sounds like a cheap excuse and maybe it is. Suppression of military vote? Voter fraud? Didn’t the numbers point to a Romney win? Numbers from organizations that generally have no reason to predict such? Isn’t it well established that the left will do anything – almost anything including break the rules – to achieve its goals?

    If it turns out that no Obama won “fair and square” so be it. I sincerely hope that is the case. And even if the game was (were?) rigged so what? It means “our side” needs to step up its game.

    I think two major factors contributed to an Obama re-election. (1) The Mainstream Media. The extent to which they enable, spin and cover for the left is breathtaking. (2) And yes better outreach to “people of color”. Generally speaking, are Hispanics and African-Americans thriving in this nation?

    Comment by Rick67 — November 7, 2012 @ 7:55 am - November 7, 2012

  37. By the way, I don’t know why people are beating up on Eric. He’s giving good advice. It’s humiliating that Republicans did as poorly as they did. How much worse could the opponents have been? Don’t blame it on the media. Everyone knows they’re in the can for liberals. You want evidence of how much a social issue can hurt? Look no further than Todd Akin (R) who lost to Claire McCaskill (D) in Republican Missouri. Republicans either have to change positions on social issues or accept losing.

    Comment by David — November 7, 2012 @ 8:04 am - November 7, 2012

  38. Pres. Obama doesn’t need to blame it on Bush anymore; his complaints about Bush gradually decreased as he shifted his focus to ‘obstructionism’ in Congress. So Republicans in the House (and to a lesser extent the Senate) will be his new scapegoat.

    I agree, however, that the Republican party needs to shift to the economy. The idiotic comments by Akins and Murdock just helped the War on Women meme.

    Comment by Dale — November 7, 2012 @ 8:10 am - November 7, 2012

  39. In my opinion, the GOP has got to officially abandon this idea that coming across the border illegally is the wort thing since murder. Yes, I’m exaggerating a bit.

    Rather more than a bit, sf. It’s sad.

    Rick:

    Suppression of military vote? Voter fraud?

    1. Maybe. 2. God I hope not.

    I do notice that neither of those explanations requires voters to be stupid, or to prefer failure. The alternatives all do.

    - The Obama supporter’s explanation, that He is indeed something good: Flies against facts, and His entire bitter campaign. Thus requires people to be stupid, or at least to actively prefer failure, in their hatred of success.
    - The Hurricane / Christie ‘endorsement’ explanation: This is a polite way of saying that people are easily misled, thus stupid.
    - Even the ‘media malpractice’ explanation: requires people to be disconnected from reality, which is a kind of half-willed stupidity.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 8:16 am - November 7, 2012

  40. - Jonathan S. Tobin’s explanation, that Obama survived despite His failures in office and loss of support compared to 2008, because of His reputation as an ‘historic’ figure: Again requires people to be disconnected from reality.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 8:23 am - November 7, 2012

  41. The_Livewire, I frankly mourn the once great state of USA, us from across the pond always had the idea of moving out as last resort if things go south in socialist europe, but at this point I am simply amazed.

    I do not understand this hatred for social issues, the paradox is that there are many socialist countries around the world, and yet for whatever reason (cultural, religious etc) they have abortion laws far more conservative than USA. Same goes for gays marriage.

    If the knot of the matter is this silly stuff (‘I am not voting for Romney because I like gay people’ as I read from someone who did phone calls to registered republican voters) I do not see how you can recover and even being the pale resemblance of what you were in the past.

    I do not even feel that this is a ‘handout’ problem. If women did not vote romney because they were sure to be denied a box of Tampax at the drugstore, I wonder, is it even worthwhile to try to ‘sway’ those voters in the GOP direction?

    I mean those kind of people are dead to me even for a chat in front of the watercooler. I just cannot lower myself that much.

    Comment by susan — November 7, 2012 @ 8:32 am - November 7, 2012

  42. I do notice that neither of those explanations requires voters to be stupid, or to prefer failure. The alternatives all do.

    I enjoyed your response, but perhaps “stupid” comes in different flavors. Think about the nature of ideology. The universe works according to theory – and progressivism is an ideology. There are people whom I regard as more intelligent than I. They are quite well informed. And they said things about Romney that I can only describe as stupid and mean spirited.

    There might be people who see the facts – and are not stupid in that sense – and conclude “this is the way it should be”. They operate on a different set of rules. And *those* rules are – in my opinion – stupid in another sense.

    I respectfully disagree that being fooled or misled by the media makes people stupid. When you live in a house full of smokers eventually that second hand smoke is going to have an effect on you.

    Comment by Rick67 — November 7, 2012 @ 8:34 am - November 7, 2012

  43. [...] GayPatriot Or perhaps, the legacy media, in failing to cover Obama’s various failures and scandals, won the [...]

    Pingback by The Post Election Hangover | Ruminants — November 7, 2012 @ 8:40 am - November 7, 2012

  44. Rick, it sounds like our views are pretty similar. On your final point, where we might disagree: It’s that so many choose to live in a house full of smokers. If you’re a kid that’s one thing, but for grownups, living in a house full of smokers (sticking with the analogy) is a choice.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 8:41 am - November 7, 2012

  45. Barack Obama’s 2nd term will not be gentle; he will rule by fiat & ignore Congress. Gridlock will remain for the next 4 years as the Tea Party fights the establishment Republican hacks.

    Barack Obama has no mandate, but this will not stop him with Card Check, ObamaCare, & Crap & Tax. In fact, the Obamabots will learn they made a terrible mistake believing Obama’s lies & endless platitudes.

    Comment by Sebastian Shaw — November 7, 2012 @ 8:55 am - November 7, 2012

  46. Barack Obama doesn’t care about the deficit; now, we will won’t have any budgets at least the next 2 years. The Democrats want their Marxist Utopia. The irony is it will collapse upon them & us. See ObamaTax. A depression is in the cards for America.

    Comment by Sebastian Shaw — November 7, 2012 @ 8:59 am - November 7, 2012

  47. Expect the worst, the ‘man’ (loose term) is lacks decency and dignity.

    Comment by susan — November 7, 2012 @ 9:00 am - November 7, 2012

  48. Second terms usually play out about as well as Star Wars prequels. So, there’s that.

    Comment by V the K — November 7, 2012 @ 9:16 am - November 7, 2012

  49. I expect 4 more years of Obama lying, leading from behind, and attempting to blame Bush for the fact that Obama’s own policies can’t and won’t produce a real economic recovery.

    Pretty much agree, and don’t forget the AWOL media that seems to think the only party to call out is the republican one. The media is now an arm of the democratic party-they have totally drunk the koolaid and will no longer look with a critical eye to anything the democrats do.

    I also agree that the democrats have totally done a great job of demonizing the GOP. The democrats have convinced the electorate that the GOP is hateful, mean, bigoted and hates everyone but rich white men.

    I am not particularly convinced that the GOP can do anything to reach out to these groups and actually get their vote. The media once again does an awesome job of assisting them (and admittedly some of the candidates do themselves more harm than good, but do you guys really think Mia Love hates gays, blacks, brown people, and women?). I think these groups are democratic party robots until they choose to take the blinders off. The party can do what it can to appeal, but appealing to these groups isn’t going to be from anything the GOP does to reach out, but from these groups realizing voting in lockstep isn’t in their best interest.

    I do wonder though where the gay breaking point will be-right now most gays vote based on a “we want gay marriage” plank. Well the various states are slowly through courts, legislatures and referendums giving them this. DADT is gone, and soon there aren’t going to be really any hard rallying points for gays. Will the vast majority of gays continue to vote in vast majorities for the democrats?

    Comment by Just Me — November 7, 2012 @ 9:38 am - November 7, 2012

  50. Again requires people to be disconnected from reality.

    ILC sadly I really do think the vast majority of the electorate is this stupid. I think a lot of people get hung up on a single issue, or all they know about the presidential race is what they are fed on the evening news.

    If all I did was watch the evening network news I would probably think Romney hated women, was racist and wanted all poor people to starve. I would also think Obama was the most competent president since George Washington.

    Comment by Just Me — November 7, 2012 @ 9:43 am - November 7, 2012

  51. Second terms usually play out about as well as Star Wars prequels. So, there’s that.

    Guess this is a positive, however that means the economy is going to hell in a handbasket and there isn’t much positive in that.

    Oh, and one thing that will be different in 2016 is that both candidates will be exposed during the primary season and neither is going to have a summer of free reign in battleground states to define and demonize their opponent.

    My only concern is that the DNC will identify the best and brightest of the GOP hopefuls and do everything they can to kill their viability as a candidate before they have a chance to declare. The DNC is good at this method of character assassination-the GOP not so much (although I do think Benghazi has and will effectively end any hopes of Hillary or Petraeus as candidates unless Hillary finds some way to salvage herself and tosses Obama under the bus in the process).

    Comment by Just Me — November 7, 2012 @ 9:49 am - November 7, 2012

  52. It didn’t matter what the conservative message was, or who was running against Obama. Numbers are growing of those who believe our government is the answer to all our needs. Our nation is heading in the direction of the European entitlement states…to be followed by demonstrations and rioting, when the socialists run out of taxpayer dollars. When half the population has to work to support the other half, it’s not sustainable!

    Comment by Christine — November 7, 2012 @ 10:38 am - November 7, 2012

  53. “I have to say I’m surprised. Just watching … The base seemed more energized.”

    Outside the conservative media, the narrative was completely different. Its driving force was Nate Silver, whose performance forecasting Election ’08 gave him credibility … But Silver’s expertise was always a better bet than relying on… the anecdotal impressions of Noonan.

    It is easy to close oneself off inside a conservative echo chamber. And right-leaning outlets like Fox News and Rush Limbaugh’s show are far more intellectually closed than CNN or public radio. If you’re a rank-and-file conservative, you’re probably ready to acknowledge that ideologically friendly media didn’t accurately inform you about Election 2012.”

    Comment by Passing By — November 7, 2012 @ 12:26 pm - November 7, 2012

  54. I said

    In my opinion, the GOP has got to officially abandon this idea that coming across the border illegally is the worst thing since murder. Yes, I’m exaggerating a bit.

    ILC, completely ignoring the point I was making, replied:

    Rather more than a bit, sf. It’s sad.

    No, what is sad is that you choose to give a snide reply instead of going into any depth on why the GOP only got 28 % of the Hispanic vote. Suddenly you want to flush the preferred GOP immigration policy down the memory hole. Do you really think the severely negative rhetoric concerning illegal immigrants and the actions that culminated with the schizophrenic gyrations of Arizona’s card check law didn’t hurt your chances winning over this demographic group?

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 7, 2012 @ 12:26 pm - November 7, 2012

  55. ILC, completely ignoring the point I was making

    No, jackass. I didn’t ignore it. Rather, I thought it was wrong, to the point where it was really really sad that you would stoop to repeating such a false left-wing trope.

    And I still think that. Your snideness has not changed my mind.

    Get it? Your comment was incredibly lame, sf. I still think it. I’m still pointing it out.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 12:52 pm - November 7, 2012

  56. People’s jackass comments don’t deserve a longer response than that. But for the sake of other folks / posterity, I shall note that:

    - I’m not a Republican. Never been one in my life.
    - And yet even I understand that at no point has the GOP had an “idea that coming across the border illegally is the worst thing since murder”… not even “a bit”.
    - To suggest otherwise is only to make a rather cheap effort – a sad one – to tar people who have legitimate border security concerns, as racists. It’s a tactic of the Left.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 1:05 pm - November 7, 2012

  57. Instead of being lulled into a belief of real change by the punditry of Dick Morris and Michael Barone, who predicted Romney by a landslide and Karl Rove´s little white board. I should have reread the March Edition of Horoscope Magazine. Astrologer Michael O´Reilly wrote several months prior to publication (about December 2011) that Romney´s chart indicated he could be the Republican nominee. but the election day chart showed an Obama win; ¨. . transiting Pluto trines Obama´s Pluto, the ruler of his midheaven, on Election Day. This closely parallels the Pluto factors that got George Bush (Senior) elected in 1988 and George W. Bush in 2000.¨ Following several other aspects he concludes that ¨All these connections to U.S. Moon indicate good rapport with voters.¨ In other words, likeability. Several months back I commented on a thread that dispite all of the negativity he has the one thing he had that Romney didn´t have was likeability. While it fell and Romney´s rose it never really over took Obama´s And it came to the fore with his photo op in New Jersey after Sandy. Just as Romney was quick to issue a statement on Benghazi, only to be criticized, maybe instead of turning a campaign rally into a rally for victims he should have gone uninvited to New Jersey, Chris Chrisites comments not withstanding; ¨I don´t give a damn about the election.¨ Obama did. If Romney had gone to show support for the first governor to endorse his candidacy and tour with Obama and Christie he might have gotten some mileage out of embracing some victims too. Then he could have told Christie directly that his next couple of campaign days would be to raise funds and collect needed necessites to give relief to the victims of Sandy. That would have been news that could have raised his likeability and show his compassion.

    Comment by Roberto — November 7, 2012 @ 1:06 pm - November 7, 2012

  58. I agree with Christine. One half of America threw the other half of America under the bus. They want theirs and ours too and Obama is willing to do that.

    Also I have read that 85 percent of the media vote Democrat and Newsbusters.org had several stories that 85 percent of the stories done on Romney were negative. Coincidence?

    This was not a race about social issues. It was a campaign about turning our country into a socialist nation whether Obama voters knew that or not.

    We get the government we deserve….Don Henley

    Comment by Linda Strickland — November 7, 2012 @ 1:17 pm - November 7, 2012

  59. As to the (separate) topic of whether the GOP could do more Latin outreach: Maybe. One could make the argument. A counter-argument is that they already are… and the media suppress it. Think of how, during the GOP convention, the white racists at MSNBC carefully avoided showing Gov. Susanna Martinez in their coverage.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 1:18 pm - November 7, 2012

  60. And another major effort the GOP needs to embrace: circumventing the mainstream media. Get together and begin a politics-only online news channel. Or several. Start a new network. Begin a TV/online/downloadable app for real-time streaming of live video clips similar to Twitter. Make it interactive, meaning the viewer can upload and post on the fly. Start an economics course for free download using free markets as its basis. There are so many things the GOP could spearhead in order to turn low-information voters into some-information voters.

    Comment by Ignatius — November 7, 2012 @ 2:00 pm - November 7, 2012

  61. I am not particularly convinced that the GOP can do anything to reach out to these groups and actually get their vote. The media once again does an awesome job of assisting them (and admittedly some of the candidates do themselves more harm than good, but do you guys really think Mia Love hates gays, blacks, brown people, and women?). I think these groups are democratic party robots until they choose to take the blinders off.

    Bingo.

    The Obama Party’s argument is free stuff based on skin color.

    That is not sustainable or intelligent, and Republicans need to be both.

    Republicans are the party of adults. The Obama Party is the party of dependent children.

    So there are simple things that Republicans need to do to start putting the dependent children in their place and give them a taste of the real world.

    1) Allow Obama’s tax increase to go through across the board. No matter what happens, force everyone’s taxes to go up.

    2) Allow the sequestration to take place. Obama wants to cripple the military so he can give more money to his drunk, stoned constituency; let him.

    3) Eat the collapse. It needed to happen anyway. There is no reason for conservatives to continue to protect things when the Obama children don’t see the need for it. They’re simply hostage-taking at this point, no differently than Palestinians putting missile launchers in schools and hospitals.

    The reasoning is very simple. Conservatives and capitalists are smarter than socialists. The history of every single totalitarian regime has borne that out; people find ways to make money even under the most repressive of regimes, and the continued flailing of the regime to suppress it just makes life worse for the true believers.

    Conservatives are liberals who have been mugged by reality. A good, stiff dose of reality is what it’s going to take to tamp down the liberal menace.

    Comment by North Dallas Thirty — November 7, 2012 @ 2:00 pm - November 7, 2012

  62. “the party of adults… simple things … to start putting the dependent children in their place and give them a taste of the real world

    “No matter what happens, force everyone’s taxes to go up.”
    “Allow the sequestration to take place.”
    “Eat the collapse. It needed to happen anyway. … simply hostage-taking

    Comment by Passing By — November 7, 2012 @ 2:57 pm - November 7, 2012

  63. Scared, Passing By?

    We figured as much. You’ve played that game that Republicans will not allow taxes to increase to take several other things hostage.

    But interestingly enough, what Republicans have finally figured out is this; it hurts you the non-working much more to have to pay taxes than it does us, the working.

    So yes, we will now hike taxes. We will be happy to eliminate the zero-level cutoff, and we will be happy to go ahead and assess taxes on welfare benefits, including food stamps.

    You want to pay the government so badly; now you can. Every single bit of anything you receive is now taxable. Away go the student-loan deductions, the mortgage deductions, everything of the sort.

    You can have your Obama paradise. But that was never your plan.

    Comment by North Dallas Thirty — November 7, 2012 @ 3:09 pm - November 7, 2012

  64. Scared, Passing By?”

    ““No matter what happens, force everyone’s taxes to go up.”
    “Allow the sequestration to take place.”
    “Eat the collapse. It needed to happen anyway.

    ” it hurts you

    “You want to pay the government so badly; now you can.”

    “What really lured Republicans into a trap was the timing of the arrangement. The beginning of 2013, when the automatic spending cuts take effect, coincides with the expiration of every penny of the Bush tax cuts. And so, by postponing the fiscal reckoning, Republicans inadvertently scheduled it for the very moment when Obama (should he win reelection) will hold his maximum leverage. Last summer, Obama was pleading with Boehner to give him $800 billion in additional revenue. Come January, he’ll have $5 trillion in higher revenue without doing anything. Since Obama’s own budget proposes to raise only $1.5 trillion in new revenue and trim entitlement spending, he could then offer Republicans a deal that cuts taxes (by, say, a couple trillion dollars), increases military spending, and reduces entitlement spending. In other words, he could offer a right-wing bill—and the end result would be a mix of policies to the left of his own budget, and to the left of the Simpson-Bowles proposal.”

    Comment by Passing By — November 7, 2012 @ 4:05 pm - November 7, 2012

  65. LOL.

    Problem is, Passing By, Republicans are wise to that trick.

    Across the board tax increases. You wanted the Bush tax rate reductions gone; they will be.

    You wanted sequestration; you got it.

    Conservatives don’t like raising taxes, but we will gladly do so if there are simultaneous forced spending cuts. The only way tax increases will dig us out of the deficit hole is if they are across the board anyway.

    With the added benefit that Obama idiots such as yourself would actually start paying taxes on your entitlement benefits, and thus offset the massive drain that you represent to the economy annually.

    As conservative websites are putting it, it’s time to shoot the hostages. You wanted tax increases and massive defense spending cuts; you can have them. Conservatives are far better equipped to deal with the consequences of increased taxes than financially-incompetent and dependent liberals are because we are producers and can raise the price of our goods and services; Obama base members like yourself are consumers, and have to pay us whatever price we demand.

    Comment by North Dallas Thirty — November 7, 2012 @ 5:05 pm - November 7, 2012

  66. Once again, I said:

    In my opinion, the GOP has got to officially abandon this idea that coming across the border illegally is the worst thing since murder. Yes, I’m exaggerating a bit.

    To which you replied:

    No, jackass. I didn’t ignore it. Rather, I thought it was wrong, to the point where it was really really sad that you would stoop to repeating such a false left-wing trope.

    Jackass??? Really???? For a party that claims to not be motivated by emotions but rather by reason, you guys sure do get emotional a lot. Did you not see the bit where I wrote “Yes, I’m exaggerating a bit.“? And still, the question hangs out there like one of Al Gores hanging chads. What could you have done better to convince more Hispanics / Latinos to come over to your side?

    And for that matter, how do you possibly expect to win any national elections in the future if you keep insulting 50% of the public by calling them “takers” and “moochers”? That is what I heard all day driving around listening to Conservative talk radio. That kind of attitude is definitely NOT going to win over any hearts and minds of those who are not as partisan as you, especially if they have found the only way to survive is, as a last resort, to accept some form of government subsidy.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 7, 2012 @ 7:21 pm - November 7, 2012

  67. Once again, I said: [blah blah blah, jackass nonsense emphasizing "a bit" pompously as if ILC somehow hadn't seen it]

    And, to what you said, I said this:

    [you have exaggerated] Rather more than *a bit*, sf. It’s sad.

    at no point has the GOP had an “idea that coming across the border illegally is the worst thing since murder”… not even “*a bit*”

    How long shall we do this *bit*? I do trust *a bit*that you can scan English words, but not that you necessarily comprehend *a bit* of what the other person is saying.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 8:41 pm - November 7, 2012

  68. the question hangs out there

    Clean answers are for clean questions. As I’ve explained, yours wasn’t.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 8:51 pm - November 7, 2012

  69. [...] After reading this (h/t Gay Patriot), I think I have decided why Romney lost this election.  It was simply because the Republicans, as [...]

    Pingback by It’s Time for Some Fun (Data Analysis!) « Canadian Rattlesnake — November 7, 2012 @ 9:06 pm - November 7, 2012

  70. And still, the question hangs out there like one of Al Gores hanging chads. What could you have done better to convince more Hispanics / Latinos to come over to your side?

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 7, 2012 @ 7:21 pm – November 7, 2012

    Nothing.

    Republicans offered opportunity, reduction of government regulation, and the chance to succeed.

    Obama offered racial preferences, government perks based on skin color, and unlimited rewards for lawbreaking.

    Hispanics and Latinos overwhelmingly chose racism, discrimination, and illegality.

    So who cares? I have no desire to make government more racist or to reward people for illegal behavior. You go right ahead and advocate that — preferably in the Obama Party.

    And for that matter, how do you possibly expect to win any national elections in the future if you keep insulting 50% of the public by calling them “takers” and “moochers”? That is what I heard all day driving around listening to Conservative talk radio. That kind of attitude is definitely NOT going to win over any hearts and minds of those who are not as partisan as you, especially if they have found the only way to survive is, as a last resort, to accept some form of government subsidy.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 7, 2012 @ 7:21 pm – November 7, 2012

    Because, Sonic, I don’t give a rat’s ass about hurting these peoples’ feelings.

    San Francisco has paid at least $150,000 for Kenny Walters in the past year. He isn’t employed, has an arrest record as long as his hair, and can often be found passed out in a doorway on Haight Street.

    Kenny Walters’ job is to get drunk.

    Or these peoples’:

    Stanley Thornton Jr., 30, is a self-described “adult baby,” who sleeps in a huge crib, drinks from a bottle, wears diapers, lives with a former nurse who acts as his “mom”… and subsists on Social Security disability benefits.

    Or the leaders of the Obama Party.

    Besides not paying those pesky taxes, Mr. Rangel had other reasons for wanting to hide income. As the tenant of four rent-stabilized apartments in Harlem, the Congressman needed to keep his annual reported income below $175,000, lest he be ineligible as a hardship case for rent control. (He also used one of the apartments as an office in violation of rent-control rules, but that’s another story.)

    Mr. Rangel said last fall that “I never had any idea that I got any income’’ from the villa. Try using that one the next time the IRS comes after you. Equally interesting is his claim that he didn’t know that the developer of the Dominican Republic villa had converted his $52,000 mortgage to an interest-free loan in 1990. That would seem to violate House rules on gifts, which say Members may only accept loans on “terms that are generally available to the public.” Try getting an interest-free loan from your banker.

    The National Legal and Policy Center also says it has confirmed that Mr. Rangel owned a home in Washington from 1971-2000 and during that time claimed a “homestead” exemption that allowed him to save on his District of Columbia property taxes. However, the homestead exemption only applies to a principal residence, and the Washington home could not have qualified as such since Mr. Rangel’s rent-stabilized apartments in New York have the same requirement.

    Your solution for being a spineless coward towards these people abusing the hell out of the welfare system is to a) demand that my taxes be hiked to pay for them and b) call me a meanie for calling them moochers, looters, and takers.

    What I am figuring out, Sonic, is that people like you do not respect morals, values, or productivity — only power and brute force. You expect me to bear even more of the load because I am good, I am productive, and I believe in working and paying my way, while you let these people coast on my labor and on my back.

    To hell with you. For you to protect these people and demand that I shut up and take what is outright abuse of my labor, my values, and my productivity, all because you want to suck Barack Obama’s cock, is criminal.

    Comment by North Dallas Thirty — November 7, 2012 @ 9:20 pm - November 7, 2012

  71. No more alienating talking points about “takers”

    Focus on the economy, spending, taxes and responsible governance.

    The latter necessarily entails the former.

    You’re getting hammered in the minority vote, youth vote, and women’s vote (you lost it 55-44), not because you’re party’s positions are offensive to those groups, but because you just haven’t performed enough “outreach.”

    No, because there are too many stupid people who believe what the Media et al. say about conservatives. And, yes, they are stupid. The entire American electorate is becoming very stupid (public schools probably have something to do with that). And in the case of minorities, there doesn’t seem to be enough independent thought to overcome the group think by a significant enough margin (and I assume independent thought occurs at the same rate among all races; it is just that there isn’t as much group think among Whites because they aren’t a minority).

    As for social issues, again, people who vote a certain way because they agree with those people on social issues even if they agree with the other side on economic issues are stupid. There is just too much stupidity.

    The Republicans have spent too much time playing politics and not enough time focusing on their own principles (by which I mean Tea Party principles, which are supposed to be the principles of the Republican Party). Regardless of how popular or unpopular their positions are, they should run on them and not what they perceive to be popular. No pandering to Hispanics, no yielding on taxes or immigration, just nothing but pure principles. At least, they should do that next time. I like what NDT is saying about going with the Democrats with their inevitably disastrous policies (for now, until the collapse comes. Maybe while repeating what they know is going to happen, so they are proven right, and maybe then people will learn something, although I’m not under the impression that that is very likely).

    Comment by Rattlesnake — November 7, 2012 @ 9:54 pm - November 7, 2012

  72. You wanted sequestration; you got it.”

    Most Republicans who are howling about the sequester did vote for it. In their push for a replacement, they beclowned themselves…

    They make no mention of the fact that they caused it and voted for it knowing that the sequester would take effect. “

    Comment by Passing By — November 7, 2012 @ 10:39 pm - November 7, 2012

  73. Your solution for being a spineless coward towards these people abusing the hell out of the welfare system is to a) demand that my taxes be hiked to pay for them and b) call me a meanie for calling them moochers, looters, and takers.

    The key point. sf does not advocate leftism (that I know of), and yet his comments so often seen to come down to “Why do you meanies not credit left-wing shibboleth X? Here, I’ll rub it in your face for you. Why do you crazy extremists not fall over yourselves to give in to the Left? It’s so much more fun when you do; then you can put down conservatives like Andrew Sullivan does, and feel confident of your leftie musician buddy not rejecting you.”

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 7, 2012 @ 11:34 pm - November 7, 2012

  74. What I am figuring out, Sonic, is that people like you do not respect morals, values, or productivity — only power and brute force….

    Oh yawn. I’m not the one bitching because my party candidate lost the election… i voted for Gary Johnson BTW. You lost the Presidency by a good margin, and all you can do is call voters morons, moochers and takers. Hope you enjoy seeing your party become a minority, because your behavior is a sure fire way to guarantee that outcome.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 8, 2012 @ 1:28 am - November 8, 2012

  75. Why do you meanies not credit left-wing shibboleth X?

    Huh?

    I’m simply pointing out that your committing a slow political suicide by insulting a good portion of the voting public instead of being retrospective, figuring out why you lost, and then making changes so that not as many people are repulsed by the notion of voting Republican. Of course there are some who would never consider doing that, even if there were a gun to their heads. But there are voters out there who would consider that choice, yet I doubt they will respond to being called takers and moochers. You guys should be able to do better than that I would think.

    Then again, judging from the long history of comments here at GP, maybe my faith in your abilities to stop being complete dicks is misplaced.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 8, 2012 @ 1:38 am - November 8, 2012

  76. You lost the Presidency by a good margin, and all you can do is call voters morons, moochers and takers.

    Probably because that’s exactly what you should call these kinds of people.

    Hope you enjoy seeing your party become a minority, because your behavior is a sure fire way to guarantee that outcome.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 8, 2012 @ 1:28 am – November 8, 2012

    Why would that be, Sonic?

    Do you think your belief that those people like I outlined above are entitled to collect welfare at everyone else’s expense is in the least mainstream?

    Or is it because you want to collect welfare, and don’t like being reminded of it?

    Comment by North Dallas Thirty — November 8, 2012 @ 2:49 am - November 8, 2012

  77. Do you think your belief that those people like I outlined above are entitled to collect welfare at everyone else’s expense is in the least mainstream?

    Oh look! A straw man. Playing the same old games I see. NTD, as usual, thank you for answering my question in the affirmative.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 8, 2012 @ 10:07 am - November 8, 2012

  78. I’m simply pointing out that your committing a slow political suicide by insulting a good portion of the voting public

    Nope. You’re not “simply doing that.” That could well be worth discussing; but what you actually said was a different proposition altogether:

    In my opinion, the GOP has got to officially abandon this idea that coming across the border illegally is the wort thing since murder. Yes, I’m exaggerating a bit.

    More than “a bit”, sf. It’s sad.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 8, 2012 @ 10:43 am - November 8, 2012

  79. Now run off and please your leftie friends, by telling them what they like to hear, that conservatives (or in my case, libertarian-conservative independents) are meanies. Go on.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 8, 2012 @ 10:47 am - November 8, 2012

  80. Oh look! A straw man. Playing the same old games I see

    LOL :-) sf, you should talk.

    Comment by ILoveCapitalism — November 8, 2012 @ 11:04 am - November 8, 2012

  81. ILC… Are you still stuck on that? What part of “I’m exaggerating” don’t you understand?

    On comment 80… Yeah, because the rest of you are sheep who wouldn’t dare to call him on it. That only happens if the bogus technique is employed to counter your ideology.

    And yes… I seen the rational that supposedly he’s doing it to show how silly liberal arguments are. Sorry, that doesn’t wash. His actions define him, not your defense of his lame antics.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 8, 2012 @ 11:46 am - November 8, 2012

  82. “I’ve seen”

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 8, 2012 @ 11:53 am - November 8, 2012

  83. On comment 80… Yeah, because the rest of you are sheep who wouldn’t dare to call him on it.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 8, 2012 @ 11:46 am – November 8, 2012

    Yup, because there’s no possible way you could be wrong.

    Meanwhile, yes. You’re sitting there whining and bleating that it’s mean to call people who are using the welfare system to steal from the taxpayers looters, moochers, and takers.

    You don’t like it? Good. You’re not supposed to like it. You’re supposed to be repelled by people who steal from the taxpayers using the welfare system, both because a) they’re stealing and b) they’re taking resources that could be used for people who legitimately need help.

    But your primary concern is neither a) or b); if anything, your primary concern is making sure these people don’t have their feelings hurt.

    The only rational reason you would be upset by calling a thief a thief is if you yourself were one and didn’t like it.

    Comment by North Dallas Thirty — November 8, 2012 @ 5:01 pm - November 8, 2012

  84. His actions define him, not your defense of his lame antics.”

    Comment by Passing By — November 8, 2012 @ 5:08 pm - November 8, 2012

  85. Meanwhile, yes. You’re sitting there whining and bleating that it’s mean to call people who are using the welfare system to steal from the taxpayers looters, moochers, and takers.

    Nope. It’s one thing to call out those who are actually abusing the system. I have absolutely no problem with that. But the over reaction, calling / classifying the majority of the 47 % of the population that are on some sort of assistance is both dumb and wrong. Once again, you and your followers just don’t get it. But that’s no sweat off my back. If you want to continue to lose winnable elections because of your stupid behavior…. Fine by me.

    But your primary concern is neither a) or b); if anything, your primary concern is making sure these people don’t have their feelings hurt.

    The people that are actually stealing for the system???? Who cares how they feel.

    The only rational reason you would be upset by calling a thief a thief is if you yourself were one and didn’t like it.

    Oh look… A new fallacy! Argument from motive!

    But, hey, at least you’re branching out.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 9, 2012 @ 2:59 am - November 9, 2012

  86. Actually, you DO have a problem with that, Sonic.

    I posted three examples of it, and your response was to sh*t yourself and complain how mean I was.

    Too bad. I no longer see the need to pretend that Obama supporters like yourself who scream and cry about “mean” conservatives are anything more than spoiled brats. I understand fully that you want to sit on the couch in a diaper all day and get paid for it, get yourself stone-cold drunk and pass out in a doorway in the Haight and get free medical care and housing for it, and cheat on your taxes while enjoying your rent-subsidized apartments., and that it upsets you that I call you a moocher, a looter, and a taker for doing it.

    But that is what you are.

    Liberals are all about lowering standards. More people on welfare, more people not working, more people taking from others, more people mocking and bashing work, business, and profit.

    Like ILC said, you want to suck up to liberals. Go ahead. But since that means you’re sucking up to and endorsing looters, moochers, and takers, that’s exactly what you’ve become.

    Comment by North Dallas Thirty — November 9, 2012 @ 3:59 pm - November 9, 2012

  87. I posted three examples of it, and your response was to sh*t yourself and complain how mean I was.

    Too bad. I no longer see the need to pretend that Obama supporters like yourself who scream and cry about “mean” conservatives are anything more than spoiled brats.

    My response in comment 85 nullifies the first claim, and my vote for Gary Johnson nullifies the second.

    ILC, V, and others have suggested that all you bluster and illogical arguments are an attempt to show how stupid the common liberals attempt at argument is. OK. We get it. You don’t need to do it any more, as you tend to make Conservatives look stupid.

    I think they are wrong. Your lack of debating skill is not an act, but is representative of who you really are. I would ask you to prove me wrong, but I don’t think you care either way.

    Comment by Sonicfrog — November 11, 2012 @ 6:48 pm - November 11, 2012

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